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The Cross has been banned in school, a sign of the times?


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#201 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 02:22 PM

Thank you for this, Alice. It is obviously wrong to say that the UK has a campaign against Christianity in general and wearing a cross in particular. I was only thinking about this yesterday when I noticed several women at the checkouts of my local supermarket (Tesco) openly wearing crosses. Some of my students wear crosses as do some of our female staff. I wear my baptismal cross at all times though normally it cannot be seen, but, as I have said before, I have a cross and icons in my office. The head of our School of Law has a large poster of Christ in his office - it's the first thing you see as you enter. I wonder if it could be said that it is unreasonable of parents to object if a school requires a child's cross on a necklace to be removed during school PE and sports lessons for health and safety reasons. The child does not suddenly become less Orthodox or compromised in their faith. Is there too much standing on rather misplaced notions about the obvious display of this token of our faith?

#202 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 06:20 PM

There is a further point to bear in mind in the treatment of churches by the state and by local authorities in England. Parishes are able to register as charities. (My own little parish is a registered charity.) This status confers very significant tax advantages on us. We are exempt from paying local authority taxes on church premises (which tax can be considerable - a restaurant, for example, in a town centre could pay £25,000 a year). We are exempt from central government taxes which are charged on businesses. Also, there is the Gift Aid scheme. If donors fill in a simple form, we can send that form to HMRC (Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs) and central government then pays us 22% of the amount donated - in effect, the government adds 22% to our income. To be sure, the secularists do not like the fact that all tax payers subsidise places of worship but it has been so since 1601. I wonder if this generous treatment (which I must add is available to all recognised religions) is given in the respective countries of members here.

#203 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 19 July 2012 - 09:40 PM

On 11 July 2012, in the House of Commons, David Cameron, the Prime Minister, told MPs he fully supported the right to wear religious symbols at work. He said: ‘I think it is an absolutely vital freedom.’ Mr Cameron insisted the Government would change the law if necessary to make sure employees can wear religious symbols at work.

‘What we will do is that if it turns out that the law has the intention of banning the display of religious symbols in the workplace, as has come out in this case [the Nadia Eweida case], then we will change the law and make clear that people can wear religious symbols at work,’ he said.

#204 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 12:27 AM

This has just been reported: http://www.telegraph...ules-judge.html

The key point made by the judge was that Sunday's being a day of rest and worship "is not a core component of the Christian faith".

#205 Richard A. Downing

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 02:01 PM

The judge was probably right about the Church of England. It's difficult to see anything that could be called a 'core component'. I wonder if the judge actually has any knowledge of the core components of the faith taught in the Baptist communion to which the lady concerned belongs? If not, there would apear to a case for an appeal on the basis of the judge's ignorance.

I hope that, just as a Sikh can wear a turban instead of a crash helmet, an Orthodox Christtian would be able to argue that attending the Divine Liturgy on Sunday IS a core component, since missing it three weeks in a row is cannonically cause for excommunication. I'm not holding my breath over that though.

#206 Alice

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 06:41 PM

This has just been reported: http://www.telegraph...ules-judge.html

The key point made by the judge was that Sunday's being a day of rest and worship "is not a core component of the Christian faith".


A new ruling by a High Court judge - the first on the issue in nearly a decade - says that Christians have no right to decline working on Sunday as it is not a “core component” of their beliefs.


Since when did worshipping on Sunday cease being a 'core component' of Christian beliefs?!?

Kyrie Eleison! This is NOT encouraging at all.

#207 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 01:02 AM

Since when is it for judges to determine the 'core components' of Christian beliefs? And which Christian church anyway? The religious illiteracy of the courts is alarming. It would be interesting to know how the judge would react to Orthodoxy, especially this: "Also requiring reconciliation through Penitence and Confession are those who have not partaken of Communion (Can. 9 of the Apostles and Can. 2 of Antioch) or failed to go to Liturgy for three or more Sundays in a row without “grave necessity”, health difficulties or for reason of great distance in travel (Can 80 of the 6th Ecumenical Council)."

#208 Kosta

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 06:56 AM

Did the court rule that her refusal to work on certain days can lawfully lead to her termination? Or did they really pass a judgement declaring Sunday worship as not essential?

What exactly was the argument? Whether an employer has the right fire an employee for refusing work on sunday or whether sunday constitutes an essential day of worship for christians? The former deals with labor law the latter is something secular courts are unqualified to pass a pronouncement on.

#209 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 03:55 PM

Good questions. We should not rely too much on what the press says about such cases which are brought under employment law. More reliable comment and a link to the transcript of the decision can be found at this link http://www.xperthr.c...rimination.aspx

I have not analysed the decision which may reflect the way higher courts (this is only an Employment Tribunal) have interpreted employment law. The question is whether employment legislation is biased against Christians - which I don't think it is - or whether the way the legislation is construed by the courts shows bias against Christians. It is easy to see why this second point may seem an issue. I think there is no intentional bias against Christians. There are similar cases which are decided against Jews and Muslims. What I think is at issue is the failure of judges to understand the Christian faith but they may be hampered in that by the vagueness of most Christian denominations. What would happen in the case of an Orthodox Christian remains to be seen but our canons require us to attend church on Sunday.

#210 Kusanagi

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 11:09 PM

Thank you for this, Alice. It is obviously wrong to say that the UK has a campaign against Christianity in general and wearing a cross in particular. I was only thinking about this yesterday when I noticed several women at the checkouts of my local supermarket (Tesco) openly wearing crosses. Some of my students wear crosses as do some of our female staff. I wear my baptismal cross at all times though normally it cannot be seen, but, as I have said before, I have a cross and icons in my office. The head of our School of Law has a large poster of Christ in his office - it's the first thing you see as you enter. I wonder if it could be said that it is unreasonable of parents to object if a school requires a child's cross on a necklace to be removed during school PE and sports lessons for health and safety reasons. The child does not suddenly become less Orthodox or compromised in their faith. Is there too much standing on rather misplaced notions about the obvious display of this token of our faith?


I just came across this now, on my travels around UK due to work I do notice that certain parts are more religious. I was surprised to find 2 shopping malls one in East London/ Essex Area and another in Manchester with a prayer room.
In Manchester the staff I work with openly talked about confession and praying the Hil Mary even though they made joke about it as one of the guy swore, sill it was surprising to hear it in such an environment.

When I had a small baptismal cross it was admired by others twice on my train journey. Now i wear a Russian cross since I lost my original baptismal cross in the monastery somewhere.... most people at work stare at it and of course the St Catherine's ring I wear next to it as well.

Well in Saudia Arabia some building had to be destroyed because when the sun came up and a shadow was made a cross was formed.......

I see lots of youngsters wear those Roman Catholic icon bracelets or rosaries in London, though i think it is more of a fashion thing than anything else.

Im usually more happy to find an Orthodox person at my work place.:)

#211 Fr Raphael Vereshack

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Posted 01 January 2013 - 02:19 PM

Excerpts of St Augustine's sermon 198 on New Year's Day.

'Save us O Lord our God and gather us from among the nations, that we may give thanks to Thy holy name.' (Ps. 105. 47)

Now, if this feast of the pagans is celebrated today with such joy of the world and of the flesh, with the singing of meaningless and base songs, with banquets and shameful dances, if these things which the pagans do in the celebration of this false festival do not please you, then you shall be gathered from among the nations...

No one lives in any type of life without those three movements of the soul, that is, of believing, hoping, loving. If you do not believe what the pagans believe, if you do not hope for what they hope for, if you do not love what they love, then you are gathered from among the pagans; you are removed from them; that is, you are separated from the nations...

Are you going to take part in a celebration of the New Year? Are you, just like a pagan, going to play dice and become intoxicated when you believe, hope, and love otherwise? How can you then sing with an open countenance: 'Save us O Lord our God: and gather us from among the nations'?
For you are segregated from the pagans; associated with them physically, you are unlike them in your way of life...

When they give gifts; do you give alms. They are called away by songs of license; you, by the discourses of the Scriptures. They run to the theatre; you, to the church. They become intoxicated; do you fast. If you are not able to fast today, at least dine with moderation...

Now, I speak to the true Christians. If you believe, hope, and love otherwise [than the pagans do], then live otherwise and gain approval for your distinctive faith, hope, and charity by distinctive actions...

For...demons are pleased with misleading songs, with worthless shows, with the varied foulness of the theatre, with the frenzy of the games, with the cruelty of the amphitheatre, with the violent contests of those who undertake strife and controversy provocative even of hostility in their support of noxious characters, for instance, of an actor in a mime, a play, or a pantomime, of a charioteer, or of a hunter. By acting in this way they, as it were, offer incense to the demons within their hearts...

Walk then as children of light, so that we too who preach the word of the Lord to you, may with you and because of you, rejoice in perpetual light.

#212 Lakis Papas

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 12:42 AM

The ruler of this world is the devil, thus it is expected Christianity to be persecuted.

But especially today Christianity is accountable for the incorrect image of our faith that is displayed to non-Christians. In the information age, Christianity (to a large extent) fails to give testimony in a society desperately looking for a way out of its failure.

#213 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 02 January 2013 - 06:13 PM

This is true. People are more or less consciously (mostly less) wanting an answer to life's biggest questions but the wider perception of Christianity, formed by views of Anglican and Protestant failings and Roman Catholic scandals, is that is that it is a spent force with little or no relevance. Orthodoxy, we believe, has the answers to people's questions yet is hardly known, and how many will embrace it even if they get to know about it?

#214 Antonios

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 06:08 AM

This is true. People are more or less consciously (mostly less) wanting an answer to life's biggest questions but the wider perception of Christianity, formed by views of Anglican and Protestant failings and Roman Catholic scandals, is that is that it is a spent force with little or no relevance. Orthodoxy, we believe, has the answers to people's questions yet is hardly known, and how many will embrace it even if they get to know about it?


There is a growing disdain for the State on this side of the pond, and they are gaining numbers. The Orthodox faithful in this nation had no say in the first Revolution, and if there is ever to be a second one, they will play a much greater role. Indeed, never in this nation's history has it been the better time for the conversion of a nation.

#215 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 12:07 PM

Orthodox generally don't favour revolutions but with the absence of any Marcus Manlius or Cincinnatus on our political stages, it's a tempting thought, Yet, as George Savile, Marquis of Halifax, observed in the 17th century, 'when the people contend for their liberty, they seldom get anything by their victory but new masters'.

#216 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:38 AM

A mixed result from the ECHR: http://www.telegraph...ss-at-work.html

#217 Olga

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:08 PM

From the article:

But it rejected a similar legal challenge from Shirley Chaplin, a nurse, ruling that the hospital where she worked should be able to refuse permission to wear a cross on “health and safety” grounds.


It has been standard practice for many years for operating theatre nurses and surgeons to forego all jewellery, including wedding bands, necklaces/pendants and earrings, when working in theatre, to maintain proper infection control standards. Whether the hospital insists these items not be worn within the hospital outside of theatre is not made clear.

#218 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 08:31 AM

Anyone else find this scary?  http://www.telegraph...-passwords.html






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