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Priest mistakes during mysteries


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#1 Kostandin

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 10:16 AM

Hello

 

As a new member I greet all the older members.

 

I am an orthodox Christian but I am not sure how much importance has the correctness of the priest during performing a mystery.

I know that the Roman Catholic church overemphasize this, asking from the priest to pronounce the correct formula etc...

 

(I am speaking for mistakes done unintentionally, for example if during the baptism, the priest forget to pronounce the name of one Person of Trinity during one of the three immersions. Or similar cases.)

 

Let me know if these unintentional mistakes makes a mystery or sacrament invalid

 

Thanks in Advance



#2 Anna Stickles

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:39 PM

Neither the mistakes, nor even the sins of priests invalidates the Mysteries. 

 

Our participation does not cause the Church which is Christ's Body to become less than it is, nor imperfect, but rather we all, priests included, participate in the Church in order to be made perfect.



#3 Kostandin

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:59 PM

Thank you Anna. Does this include also the unintentional mistakes in the "form" or " formula" of the Sacrament / Mystery ?

#4 Father David Moser

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 02:06 PM

My spiritual father told me when I was ordained that one of the things that the guardian angel of the priest does is to say the prayers along with him and if the priest errs or falters, the guardian angel says the prayers for him.

 

Remember the sacraments are not magic spells or incantations.  We do not "make" the mystery happen, we simply enter into the mystery that is already ongoing eternally in heaven before the throne of God.  Our prayers do not validate nor invalidate they mystery, they simply open the doors of eternity to allow us access to that which already exists.  No error on the part of the priest, or anyone else for that matter, can prevent or stop the grace of God.  The only thing that will prevent us from receiving that grace is our own self will when we choose to turn away from God through sin and rebellion and lack of repentance.

 

Fr David Moser



#5 Kostandin

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 04:04 PM

Thank you for the explanations Father David



#6 Phoebe K.

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 10:12 PM

I trust that the Lord will do what he dose however well we do the liturgy (speaking as one who is still learning to sing) as we the people are as important as the Priest in the liturgy. 

 

Of course it is not just the angles present with the Priest but the Bishops from throughout time as well since we step into the heavenly liturgy, and they can step in if needed.  My Priest did say one week that St Swithun one of our local saints had been helping him (we did have a new icon of St Swithun in the Alter that week).

 

As Fr David said it is our sin which prevents us seeing the Liturgy as it really is, though we can get a glimce form what the saints who have seen it tell us.  We may also be given the smallest glimmer of vision of such things if the Lord wills as we try to assened to God through asceticisam.  As my Priest said last week at our parish feast the christian journey starts and ends with the Transfiguration and it is through this we understand the rest of the mystery of the incarnation and what we seek to find in our own lives through grace.

 

Phoebe



#7 Kusanagi

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Posted 16 August 2014 - 05:50 PM

In the case if the wrong name is said in the Baptism, this is corrected when the person takes Holy Communion, i have been told.



#8 Michał

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 03:00 PM

My spiritual father told me when I was ordained that one of the things that the guardian angel of the priest does is to say the prayers along with him and if the priest errs or falters, the guardian angel says the prayers for him.

 

Since when angels are ordained? Isn't the Eucharist the priviledge people can participate in while angels can't?



#9 Olga

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 10:45 PM

A common and ancient iconographic theme is that of the mystical Heavenly Liturgy, where the angels serve in ceaseless worship before God. They are also referred to in psalms as ministers who do His work. Angels are indeed seen vested as deacons and subdeacons in such icons; they are also depicted this way in many icons of the mystical Communion of the Apostles at the hands of Christ, the great and eternal High Priest.This theme is a common one in the lower register of the cupola, or in the apse in the altar area.

 

Holy-Eucharist-Icon.jpg

 

orthodoxworkship.jpg

 

Divine_Liturgy_-_16th_century.jpg



#10 Michał

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 10:55 PM

I asked about angels doing consecration, not serving to Christ.



#11 Paul Cowan

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Posted 28 August 2014 - 12:48 AM

Hey Olga,

 

you took that first image right from my church's website.

 

hummm, cant seem to make the hyperlink work or to simply paste the URL. Oh well.

 

Paul



#12 Anthony Cornett

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Posted 19 September 2014 - 05:09 AM

Beautiful examples, Olga. One of the Priest's prayers before the entrance also discusses the joining in service with the Angels. This is a very powerful reminder of the fullness of the service when granted the great honor of being in the Holy Bema. Of course the Cherubic Hymn itself also testifies to this for all to experience and pray.




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