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Blessing of Water on 06 January


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#21 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 12:00 PM

I should be noted that whether blessed water stays 'fresh' can depend on the type of stopper/cap/cork used. Plastic stoppers do not taint the water whereas I have known natural corks formerly used in wine bottles to give the water an unpleasant taste.



#22 Olga

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 12:51 PM

I should be noted that whether blessed water stays 'fresh' can depend on the type of stopper/cap/cork used. Plastic stoppers do not taint the water whereas I have known natural corks formerly used in wine bottles to give the water an unpleasant taste.

 

A used medicine bottle (clear glass, not green or brown) with a cork lining in the metal screw cap was used to hold holy water in a particular household. The bottle was also located opposite a window, among icons and other church paraphernalia. This bottle remained there for more than twenty years, being opened occasionally for small amounts of holy water to be dispensed. Never in all that time was there any deterioration of the water in taste or appearance. A bottle of ordinary water in the same location would have soon developed a green "smear" inside the bottle.



#23 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 01:22 PM

They had the problem at the monastery here - many bottles of holy water acquired a bad taste from corks until they started using plastic stoppers.



#24 Olga

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 01:42 PM

Corked wine, now corked holy water! ;)



#25 Kostandin

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 02:17 PM

When the Church hymns says: "Today the nature of water is sanctified", doesn't it mean that the water itself, every molecule of water in the universe is sanctified?

 

It would be very good if this is true, it shows the majesty of Christ Baptism. I don't think the main purpose of Christ Baptism was to sanctify a small amount of water, but the entire waters, isn't it? 



#26 Kostandin

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 02:20 PM

Today the nature of the waters is sanctified, 
The Jordan bursts forth and turns back the flood of its streams, 
Seeing the Master wash Himself.

To the voice of one crying in the wilderness, 
Prepare ye the way of the Lord, 
You came, O Lord, taking the form of a servant, 
Asking for baptism though you have no sin. 
The waters saw You and were afraid. 
The Forerunner began to tremble and cried out, saying: 
How shall the lampstand illumine the Light? 
How shall the servant lay hands upon the Master? 
Sanctify both me and the waters, O Savior, 
Who takes away the sins of the world.

- Orthodox hymn for Theophany



#27 Kostandin

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 02:24 PM

Now, relating my question, so if all the water is sanctified, then why not fill a bottle of water at home?

 

My opinion is that we need to be thankful to the Lord for this wonderful gift, so out of this gratefulness we go any fill the bottles exactly were the Church has done the Blessing / Sanctification... So, doing this, we are double blessed, once  from the gift of the Lord (as all the water is sanctified) and the second from His grace to our thankfulness. You know the parable of ten lepers, all of them were healed, but only one went to thank the Lord. We try as much as we can to be as this one....

 

Is my opinion correct?



#28 Kostandin

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 02:26 PM

sorry, not parable of ten lepers, but the story of ten lepers that were healed from Christ...:)



#29 Rdr Andreas

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 03:51 PM

When the Church hymns says: "Today the nature of water is sanctified", doesn't it mean that the water itself, every molecule of water in the universe is sanctified?

 

It would be very good if this is true, it shows the majesty of Christ Baptism. I don't think the main purpose of Christ Baptism was to sanctify a small amount of water, but the entire waters, isn't it? 

 

I believe it means that water is restored to its proper function and destiny as a helping man in his spiritual life.



#30 Michał

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Posted 08 January 2015 - 07:54 PM

 

Water blessed is considered to be blessed until it is used (ether drunk or used in blessing something).  This assumes that the water is kept in a respectful way, normally on or near the icon coner in a home.

 

What about the water that get's blessed at lakes, rivers, springs etc.? When, how, and why it stops being blessed?

 

Really, we are not even allowed to let not even a drop fall on the ground.

 

Then why priest keep sprinkling it everywhere?



#31 Ben Johnson

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 02:46 AM

Here is an interesting article about water:  http://www.orthodoxy...khiltoWater.php



#32 Angie

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 03:41 AM

The priests should not be sprinkling the Holy Water at all.  Only the small holy water can be sprinkled at home, not the big one, 6th January.

 

I don't know why they do this, but really shouldnt.

 

I get told that its the same, but its not.  If it is the same, then why do we have to fast to take the Holy Water on the 6th?


Edited by Angie, 09 January 2015 - 03:43 AM.


#33 Kosta

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 04:29 AM

Angie you are correct in that is what they used to say. From what I remember the changeover occured about 10 years ago. In fact to this very day its still spoken about, with the older generation of greeks still wondering what happened. The "mikro ayiasmo" was for anointing and blessing objects while the "meyalo ayiasmo" was reserved for drinking only. Hence my mother's remarks that they ( the new generation) don't know what their doing anymore.

Edited by Kosta, 09 January 2015 - 04:30 AM.


#34 Olga

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 07:45 AM

Angie you are correct in that is what they used to say. From what I remember the changeover occured about 10 years ago. In fact to this very day its still spoken about, with the older generation of greeks still wondering what happened. The "mikro ayiasmo" was for anointing and blessing objects while the "meyalo ayiasmo" was reserved for drinking only. Hence my mother's remarks that they ( the new generation) don't know what their doing anymore.

 

In my fifty years' experience in the Church, the holy water blessed at Theophany has always been used to sprinkle people and objects, be it in Greek or Russian churches. This includes during the appointed procession around the church, where the procession stops at each of its four walls, and the church and people are sprinkled.

 

Sprinkling also is done during the custom of the blessing of waterways. Where I live, this is done by the Greeks, and occurs on the pier over one of the city's beaches. After this blessing, a wooden cross is thrown into the water, to be retrieved by young men waiting below.



#35 Kostandin

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 10:14 AM

The intention of Holy Water is to be sprinkled in order to bless the other objects also. This is true for the water blessed on 06 Jan and the water blessed in any time from the Church...Also we can drink it after fast. This is the practice I have seen for 23 years. Also what have been told from the ancestors of our faith.



#36 Father David Moser

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 03:23 PM

At least one reason why priests sprinkle the holy water everywhere is that it is stated in the rubrics of the service that he is supposed to do so - it is a part of the service of blessing water - whether the great blessing at Theophany or the smaller blessing at other times of the year. So for those who say priest "shouldn't do this" the problem is that you are contradicting the liturgical tradition of the Church as preserved in our typicon.

There is no actual difference between water blessed at the great blessing on theophany and the small blessing at other times - the perceived differences are pious customs that have arisen around how we use and approach holy things. These good customs to keep especially the ones that we have been taught by our elders, and certainly we should observe the intent of those customs - but they are not requirements.

Fr David Moser

#37 Kosta

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Posted 09 January 2015 - 10:45 PM

Thank you Father, the thing about pious customs makes sense. From what I remember there was a small blessing of the waters the day before Theoohany (greeks don't know about the others) and it was said that this water should be used for sprinkling but the blessing of water for Theophany service was for drinking.

This is what Angie is talking about and I can vouch this perception was the case indeed

Edited by Kosta, 09 January 2015 - 10:46 PM.


#38 Angie

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 04:44 AM

Kosta I agree with your mother.

 

I will continue not to throw the Megalo Agiasmo as instructed by my spiritual father.  I truly believe that it is very holy and should not be trampled on.

 

It does not make sense to throw it, while we have the small agiasmo to do this with.

 

Why do we fast then, for one day before taking the Megalo agiasmo?  Obviously, it is very holy.


Edited by Angie, 10 January 2015 - 04:49 AM.


#39 Olga

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 04:56 AM

Angie, priests are instructed in their liturgical books to sprinkle the Theophany water to bless people and things, as Fr David stated, and as many of us observe every year. Are you saying they are wrong? :huh:



#40 Rdr Daniel (R.)

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 10:32 PM

Kosta I agree with your mother.

 

I will continue not to throw the Megalo Agiasmo as instructed by my spiritual father.  I truly believe that it is very holy and should not be trampled on.

 

It does not make sense to throw it, while we have the small agiasmo to do this with.

 

Why do we fast then, for one day before taking the Megalo agiasmo?  Obviously, it is very holy.

Might I just say that I have never been instructed to fast before partaking of the water blest at Theophany - in fact the very nature of the service being after the Liturgy means that one cannot fast (as in a total fast) before partaking of it on the day, as the fast is broken by the partaking of the Antidoron. The "normal" fast on the eve is not because of partaking of the blest water the next day it is due having catechumen being baptized at Theophany and fasting therefor the day before - as Lakis Papas explained in his post.

 

When it comes to the water blest at Theophany the instruction I personally have been given is to partake thereof at any time I feel I need to get closer to God, whether due to temptation, or danger, or what have you. My understanding is that the water is both blest and blesses not just us who partake of it through drinking or otherwise but also anything else it comes into contact with; this is a central idea that the whole of material creation can be blest and redeemed just as was the nature of water at the Jordan. That is not saying it is not very holy rather the very fact that it is very holy makes this possible.

 

In Christ.

Daniel,






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