Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

laymen (and women and children) distributing antidoron?


  • Please log in to reply
26 replies to this topic

#21 Kosta

Kosta

    Very Frequent Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,517 posts

Posted 27 March 2015 - 06:08 AM

The antidoron simply tastes so good, The kids love it and will quiet down to eat it instead of annoying their parents. Thats really what it comes down to.  



#22 Father David Moser

Father David Moser

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 3,581 posts
  • Orthodox Christian Member
  • Verified Cleric

Posted 27 March 2015 - 01:32 PM

Since "antidoron" is not the ideal term to use in this context, what is a better term?  :)

The proper term is "zapivka" or "aftersupper".  This is a Slavic tradition which serves to clear the mouth from any remaining particles of the Holy Mysteries that might remain in order to avoid any chance that they would be "left behind" kissing the cross, kissing an icon, kissing the hand of the priest, etc.  The Byzantine tradition tends more towards a strict prohibition on kissing anything (even the cross at the end of the service) after receiving until one has taken food and drink.

 

Fr David



#23 Father David Moser

Father David Moser

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 3,581 posts
  • Orthodox Christian Member
  • Verified Cleric

Posted 27 March 2015 - 01:39 PM

What is often seen in the Russian church is people collecting their small prosphoron after communing and partaking of the zapivka (antidoron and a sip of blessed wine diluted with warm water), breaking up this prosphoron, and distributing it to others, in memory of a named loved one, much like the sharing of kollyva or other food at funerals and memorials.

This again is something quite different.  These small prosphori are usually purchased at the candle stand and sent into the altar with a "pomyanik" (commemoration book) which is a list containing the names of Orthodox living and departed.  The priest then takes a small fragment from the loaf as he commemorates the names at the proskomedia and places these fragments on the paten with the lamb.  The fragments are swept into the chalice after the distribution of Holy Communion along with the other non-conscrated fragments (mother of God, saints, living and dead) that remain on the paten. The loaves themselves are then returned to those who purchased them as a blessing and remembrance of those for whom they pray. These prosphori are not strictly antidoron, but are used in the same way - often taken home and consumed throughout the ensuing week with a little holy water each morning to break the fast of the night time sleep.

 

Fr David



#24 Jim McQuiggin

Jim McQuiggin

    Regular Poster

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 55 posts
  • Orthodox Christian Member

Posted 27 March 2015 - 01:51 PM

Thanks to all who have replied.

 

I would like to emphasize that I am not asking under what circumstances it is appropriate for people to eat antidoron. Rather, I am asking if it is appropriate for a layman (man, woman, or child) to take the antidoron and start giving it to people. It occurs like this:

 

Bob, a simple layman, has just taken Communion. He then immediately gets 5 pieces of antidoron and walks up to Ian and gives Ian a piece. Then he walks up to a visiting couple, and gives them two pieces. Finally he walks up to Mike and Jennifer and gives them each a piece of antidoron.

 

While Bob is doing this, a 6-year-old child named Mary has also taken 3 pieces of antidoron, and she starts wandering about the church, wondering who she will give it to. She bumps into her friend, Hannah, so she gives Hannah a piece. Then she decides that it would be a good idea to give a piece to Hannah's father. Finally, she decides to give a piece to each of her friends Eli and Michael. Oops! She has only one piece left. So she breaks it in half and gives half to Eli and half to Michael.

 

While Bob and Mary are doing this, at least 6 or 8 other laypeople are also wandering the church, handing out antidoron in similar fashion. This is all happening while people are approaching the Chalice.

 

Is this a good situation, or a bad situation, or a gray area? Further, were Roman Christians and their children doing this each Sunday, or is this a modern development?

This happens in my parish too. I really don't like it. First of all, it means that those running around the nave looking for someone to give it to are paying more attention to that than to the Sacrament itself. It also leads to awkward situations: a visitor who doesn't know what's going on will often refuse, thinking it's Communion. The practice really gives the wrong message on many levels. However, my priest has never said anything about it, and I doubt that he will. I'm reluctant to bring it up with him as in our very small parish, I end up taking a lot of things to him and would rather save myself for other issues. I suppose I should bring it up with some other laypersons to see what they think.



#25 Kusanagi

Kusanagi

    Very Frequent Poster

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 716 posts

Posted 31 March 2015 - 10:26 AM

In the UK I have noticed:

 

In the Greek Churches it is usually the older generation women hand out the Antidorons after they have had Holy Communion and they give it to their friends that didn't go.

 

Both Russians and Romanians at the end of the service tend to have Altar boys or men hold the trays or bowls with the Antidorons for people to take. But it depends on the size of the Church.

 

I personally think it is a custom and also in Romania, it is known that some people take antidoron home for those who are ill and are unable to come to Church.



#26 Olga

Olga

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • 2,821 posts
  • Orthodox Christian Member

Posted 31 March 2015 - 12:51 PM

I personally think it is a custom and also in Romania, it is known that some people take antidoron home for those who are ill and are unable to come to Church.

 

Many Greeks and Russians do this as well. :)



#27 Anthony Cornett

Anthony Cornett

    Contributor

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 77 posts
  • Orthodox Christian Member

Posted 14 September 2015 - 06:38 AM

For the bread after receiving Holy Communion, in my experience, it is the same blessed bread distributed as Antidoron at the end of the service. In parish practice, everyone is usually invited/welcome to receive this at the end of the service. I was also taught the practice of fasting before partaking antidoron. If this was strictly enforced, then it would simply occur as many Athonite monasteries: non Orthodox do not partake of antidoron. It is also practiced in the monasteries, and perhaps at some parishes, particularly those with few loaves of prosfora, that if you received Holy Communion, and partook of the bread afterwards (serving the preventative function as mentioned above), then you don't approach at the end of the service for Antidoron (instead of the gifts). In this case, it is reserved for Orthodox members who have prepared/fasted but are not able to Commune for some reason or another. 






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users