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Orthodoxy and Catholicism


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#41 Peter K.

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 03:14 PM

I know that there is a great rift (schism) between the Catholic Faith and Our Eastern Orthodox Tradition. Could someone explain in layman's terms what that shcism is and what it implies.

pj kakos

#42 Rdr Daniel (R.)

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 06:00 PM

I presume you are referring to what the schism means today, rather than historical causes. Basically, it means the See of Rome cut herself of from the rest of the Church by her actions in the past and her unrepentance since. We are no longer in communion with her, with the Patriarch of Rome (the Pope) no longer in the Orthodox bishops' diptychs i.e. not commemorated at the Liturgy. In practical terms it means that the Orthodox may not communion in what are now called Roman Catholic churches nor Roman Catholics in Orthodox Churches.

P.S. To the moderators, I realize posting on relations between the Orthodox Church and Christian dominations is on the border line of the scope of this forum, I think it is ok as a quick reply in this instance, but please feel free to remove it if it be not.

In Christ.
Daniel,

#43 Peter K.

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 07:56 PM

Thank you Daniel, but you still did not answer the question of the cause of the schism; to say the Latin Church or "See of Rome cut herself of[f] from the rest of the Church by her actions in the past and her unrepentance since" does not explain the schism. The real question is , what separates us from the Western See?

In Christ,

Peter k.

#44 Phoebe K.

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:27 PM

in essence the problem comes down to the addition of the filoque (and the son) to the creed unilaterally This addition was origanly rejected by Rome, however under the infulence of the holy Roman emperor it was accepted, but this was as for the most part the partiach of Rome was controlled because the holy Roman emperor bankroled the western church.

There was already a theological drift apart between east and west but the political situadition of the holy Roman emperor trying to bring the Rome and the other partiaches back together however this was more of the holy Roman emperor forcing his will on the other partiaches and it did not take it well.

this is explained more fully in the threads on the skisam on other parts of the websire.

Phoebe

#45 Rdr Daniel (R.)

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:49 PM

Dear Peter,

Regarding the cause of the schism, it was a multitude of factors, the main being the centralising of the western bishops under the Rome with Rome wishing to exert authority over the other sees. Along with the renunciation by Rome of the Holy Synod of New Rome (Constantinople) under Saint Photius the Great (sometimes called the Eighth Ecumenical Synod/Council) due to their acceptance of the false dogma of the Filioque (that is to say the false Roman Catholic teaching that the Holy Spirit proceeds eternally from the Son) which the Holy Synod condemned. Along with other theological and political issues.

The ultimate cause could be said to be the Franks who where against the Roman Empire in the East, insisted on the Filioque (accusing the Orthodox of removing it from the Creed), relied almost solely on Augustinian theology and wished to control Christendom using the see of Rome.

As the Roman Catholics persist in theological and ecclesiological errors they are still separate from the Church.

There have been many threads regarding the various issues which separates Rome from the other Churches, and much information can be found on Orthodox websites.

Here are two I found with the search feature I've not read through them but they about this topic
http://www.monachos....-Catholic-views

http://www.monachos....-about-filioque

A short run through on the OODE website,
http://www.oodegr.co...reat_schism.htm

General searching of the forum for Catholic, Filioque, Papal, ect.. should find some interesting threads regarding this issue.

In Christ.
Daniel,

#46 Owen Jones

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 08:43 AM

I also think it is helpful to observe differences in belief practice today as well and that actually will help get a sense of the different orientations of the two and those different orientations go way, way back.
Also, if you look at so-called Western intellectual tradition, what we have today with the various nihilistic systems is a kind of iconoclasm that is in reaction to a reification of theological language symbols as if they are referring to objective facts. This objectification of the faith is something that is resisted in the East, and we fought our battle over iconoclasm much, much earlier than the post-schism Church in the West, and I think that is why Orthodoxy prevailed in the East, whereas iconoclasm was able to take hold in the West, with various nonsensical intellectual formulations and counter formulations being the status quo to this day in the "West." But to sum it up, I would argue that Orthodox theology has always been experiential (mystical) whereas in the West -- and one can debate the origins of this, going back to the influence of the Franks -- intellectual systematizing takes place. I think that Orthodox faithful should always resist the temptation to understand Christian theology as a system.

#47 Max Percy

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 01:19 AM

That we love neither God, nor one another well enough




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