Predestination

[hk h]

Hello, I received an interesting question from one, and was wandering how you all would go about answering this:


"Since the crucifixion is an essential aspect of the Christians salvation, then of those who contributed to this act i.e. the soldiers, the Jewish elders, and even Judas - aren't they to be regarded as noble instruments of the divine plan? For if it were not for them, then there would have been no sacrafice, and thus there would have been no atonement for the sins of mankind."

[Byron Jack Gaist]

Judas, the Jewish Elders, the Roman soldiers may have been instruments of the divine plan (and I write 'may' because I don't know the divine plan!), but that does not render them "noble". Nevertheless, there is a serious and important question here, related to the 'problem of suffering' thread. Can good ever result from evil?

Yours in Christ,

Byron

[Mark McMonagle]

Hello all, I am a new poster to this list although I have received periodic posts from Monachos.Net for quite some time. I am from Upstate New York (the other New York). I am a Deacon in a small mission here.

I would like to thank hk h for seeing something that I almost mentioned myself a week ago. I think that everybody played a significant role in the salvation of mankind. For instance, the Jews who have often been vilified in history as Christ killers have been persecuted unjustifiably. There are two reasons why I think this. First, as the Jews have been assigned the role of priesthood for the nations it was incumbent on them that they offer up the Lamb of God. No body else was qualified to do so. Secondly, "Father, forgive them, they know not what they do." This was all part of the plan. It is hard for me to grasp that this would be a static, template kind of plan. The gravity of each participating member of the divine plan should not be underestimated. Judas did betray Christ and destroyed himself in grief and shame which consequently means that he the nobility of his action is moot. I don't know how God can know the future or plan that a certain thing be carried out without implicating Him as capricious. That is why He is God, is unfathomable and wise beyond our ever grasping. So, the predestination implication is more of a theological hairball than any of us can swallow. As the season implores us, 'fall down on your knees' and worship.

from a yankee sinner,
Fr. John McMonagle

[Moses Anthony]

CAN GOOD EVER COME FROM EVIL? That is a matter of whether you are among "...the group of robbers", the unfortunate victim, or you are the "good Samaritan."

The Apostle Peter however wrote that, "...if when you do wrong and suffer for it, what good is that? But if when you do what is right and suffer for it, you patiently endure it this finds favor with God. For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, for you to follow in His steps."
So, can "good come from evil", yes!

the sinful and unworthy servant