Help with text

[Warren Bensinger]

Could someone tell me what version and chapter and verse I can find direction as to helping poor and widows and orphans and burying the dead?

I've tryed everything I can on Bible Gateway and have come up with nothing that puts all of these together. I'm especially interested in the last phrase of "burying the dead".

Thanks
warren

[Waldemar]

But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead. - Matthew 8:22

Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.
- Luke 9:60

Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. - James 1:27

[Hermit]

I don't believe there is any such passage putting all that together.

(NIV) Matthew 8:22
But Jesus told him, "Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead."

James 1:27
Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

[Warren Bensinger]

Waldemar and the Hermit:

Thanks for the return. Yes I found all of those verses. Boy it's funny when something sticks in your mind. Maybe that's how herasies are started. Well I'm not trying to start a new religon so I'll let it drop.

Thanks again for your quick come back.
warren

[Fr Averky]

Dear in Christ Warren,

There are several Biblical references concerning widows, and here are a few:

Genesis 38:1 Tamara..Remain a widow at thy father's house.

Psalm 145: 9 He shall adopt for his own the orphan and widow..." (used in the Divine Liturgy)

Isaiah 1:17 Learn to do right; Seek justice, encourage the oppressed. Defend the cause of the fatherless, plead the case of the widow.

Jeremiah 49:11 Leave your fatherless chikdren, I will protect their lives. Your widows too can trust me.

Zechariah 7:10 Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor.

1 Timothy 5 Give proper recognition to those widows who are really in need

James 1:27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widowsin their distress and to keep oneself polluted by the world.

I hope thois will help you little. As to a place where the two thoughts -widows and orphans and burying the dead are in conjunction I will look although I can think of none. May I ask the reason for your search?

Father A.

[Warren Bensinger]

Father A. bless:

Thank you for your complete list. Especially the refferance to our use in Divine Liturgy, which I don't always remember.

As to my reason for the quest...I've been reading and thinking about the ref. made in another thread about Life after Death and the quote from St. John Maximovich about the 40 days.

As a fundimentalist I would have unplugged my computer and tossed it in the junk after reading that. Even with my dedication to Calvinism, which you would think would cover that without any trouble. But...can't leave things alone so... I think.

I talked to my preist and he said after reading it the same as I have heard on here. Orthodox have different feeling about this and it's not that important.

Well with so many refferences from Saints in the notes of this message I thought it might be something to think about. (not worry about) And then I thought I remembered a verse where Jesus or one of the writers said "and bury the dead" like it was something that was important to do. It seems like it should go at the end of James 1:27, but of course it doesn't.

Now the idea (untill I searched for the verse and couldn't find it) was, maybe the task of the church during the 3 days, 40 days and after is important. Maybe thats something I can help with. And what about praying for all in our circle of people that we know that die? Do all people have to run the gauntlet so to speak? If so with the connections we have with the Theotokos and our guardian angel and all the Saint's, should we be praying in this maner?

But like I said to Waldemar and the Hermit, I don't want to start a new cult so...

Thanks for your intrest and responce.

Learning to Love.
warren

[Fr Averky]

Dear Warren,

While it is never bad to look into the teachings of the Church, it should never be done with the aim of questioning them. As I have been saying lately, I am getting quitr worn out, and in time, so will Father Raphael, of trying to convince people that what we are telkling them is whatr the Church says, nd that they ought not go about desiring to have teir own view, or see of there bight be some other.


In the wonderful book about the Elder Porphyrios, a monk says that in order to reach salvation, people need always be obedient to the Church. Of course, all Patristic books speak of the importance of obedience, and yet today's Orthodox Christians, caught up in the values of this world, somehow feel that they need to reserve that little bit of personal "freedom." I am not necessarily talking about you, but better to sign your name, "learning to Obey" because if you cannot be obedient,then you will never understand what love in its highest spiritual sense is.

Two little Two "lessons" for you. Many years ago, Father Herman in Platina began to display irregularities in the way he did practically everything. Just one, but important enough example: In the Russian Orthodox Church, a monastic's family name is rarely written after his name, so it should be- St. John (Maximovitch)- but really, it is St. John of San Francisco. Fr. Herman did the Russian Church a great deal of diservice because of his self-will.

All too few people new to Orthodoxy fail to realize that when we are self-willed, we completely alienate ourselves from God, and if it goes un checked, we will become His enemy, and quite possibly lose our soul. That is why it is so dangerous to say,"I prefer,"I think,"I my own opinion is..."

More importantly, strictly speaking, we should never us the name Jesus by itself, which has been picked up by Roman Catholics and some Orthodox from Pentecostals. Our Saviour is Jesus who is the Christ, the Redeemer of mankind; Jesus by itself is a name-Joshua. The last time I was in the Holy Land, we somehow ended up with a woman Israeli guide, which turned out to be a great blessing. When talking about our Lord, she very carefully would only call Him Jesus, for she knew thqt to add Christ wouod acknowledge Him as Messiah, which why we Orthodox do sayit Words are very important.

As to references to death, then, just like now, poor and homeless people died with no one to pay for their burial services, and I do not even know what became of them- a common grave, left just off the road for carion? So Our Lord mentioins that it is a good Christian act to bury those who had nobody who cared for them, just like visiting the sick, feeding the hungry, and visiting those in prison. Warren, if one thinks of it, it all makes sense.


Warren, of courses the Church considers the first three, days, the fortieth, the ninetieth, and then yearly memorial services for the repose of the soul of the departed. While Orthodxy does not hold to he notion of Purgatory, which is based on a completely different idea of original sin, the death of Christ and His receiving an over-abundance of Divine G from God the Fatherrace, as did the Blessed Virgin ( thus called, "Full of grace.") from God, added to the merits of the saint, the Pope alone has the authority to dispense with so many years of suffering. In Orthodxy, we know that the souls of the departed are experiencing either the joys of heaven or the pangs of hell but not completely, because our eternal reward or punishment will be determined when Christ comes again in Glory to judge the living and the dead. So, by the giving of alms,having memorial services said, doing good works, and so on, we beg God not judge the deceased harshly, and in the end, show him mercy.


Alms can be quietly given to your priest if he and his family might be in need, to give alms to the poor and the homeless you might encounter, I can tell you, monks are always grateful for alms, and in monasteries, lots of people send a fairly large sums of money for special food to be served in the refectory in memory of their reposed loved ones on the anniversary of their repose.Many people donate icons, vlessing crosses, chalices and Gospels to their parish, and this is always a much-appreciated gift. As a person quietly gives out his alms, he ask the person to whom he is giving them,to pray for his departed.
For those of us monks who are priests, we are often asked to serve a phanikhida, or trisagion servicd, for which we gratefully receive alms. I
the bsis from Scripture for this is from the book of Tobit,not in the Protestant canon, which says, "the giving of alms covers many sins." All of us wsould hope that when we die, there will be those who will pray to God for us.

I am sure this is more than enough for you right now.

Fr. Averky

[Nina]

Dear Warren,

While it is never bad to look into the teachings of the Church, it should never be done with the aim of questioning them. As I have been saying lately, I am getting quitr worn out, and in time, so will Father Raphael, of trying to convince people that what we are telkling them is whatr the Church says, nd that they ought not go about desiring to have teir own view, or see of there bight be some other.


In the wonderful book about the Elder Porphyrios, a monk says that in order to reach salvation, people need always be obedient to the Church. Of course, all Patristic books speak of the importance of obedience, and yet today's Orthodox Christians, caught up in the values of this world, somehow feel that they need to reserve that little bit of personal "freedom." I am not necessarily talking about you, but better to sign your name, "learning to Obey" because if you cannot be obedient,then you will never understand what love in its highest spiritual sense is.

Two little Two "lessons" for you. Many years ago, Father Herman in Platina began to display irregularities in the way he did practically everything. Just one, but important enough example: In the Russian Orthodox Church, a monastic's family name is rarely written after his name, so it should be- St. John (Maximovitch)- but really, it is St. John of San Francisco. Fr. Herman did the Russian Church a great deal of diservice because of his self-will.

All too few people new to Orthodoxy fail to realize that when we are self-willed, we completely alienate ourselves from God, and if it goes un checked, we will become His enemy, and quite possibly lose our soul. That is why it is so dangerous to say,"I prefer,"I think,"I my own opinion is..."

More importantly, strictly speaking, we should never us the name Jesus by itself, which has been picked up by Roman Catholics and some Orthodox from Pentecostals. Our Saviour is Jesus who is the Christ, the Redeemer of mankind; Jesus by itself is a name-Joshua. The last time I was in the Holy Land, we somehow ended up with a woman Israeli guide, which turned out to be a great blessing. When talking about our Lord, she very carefully would only call Him Jesus, for she knew thqt to add Christ wouod acknowledge Him as Messiah, which why we Orthodox do sayit Words are very important.

As to references to death, then, just like now, poor and homeless people died with no one to pay for their burial services, and I do not even know what became of them- a common grave, left just off the road for carion? So Our Lord mentioins that it is a good Christian act to bury those who had nobody who cared for them, just like visiting the sick, feeding the hungry, and visiting those in prison. Warren, if one thinks of it, it all makes sense.


Warren, of courses the Church considers the first three, days, the fortieth, the ninetieth, and then yearly memorial services for the repose of the soul of the departed. While Orthodxy does not hold to he notion of Purgatory, which is based on a completely different idea of original sin, the death of Christ and His receiving an over-abundance of Divine G from God the Fatherrace, as did the Blessed Virgin ( thus called, "Full of grace.") from God, added to the merits of the saint, the Pope alone has the authority to dispense with so many years of suffering. In Orthodxy, we know that the souls of the departed are experiencing either the joys of heaven or the pangs of hell but not completely, because our eternal reward or punishment will be determined when Christ comes again in Glory to judge the living and the dead. So, by the giving of alms,having memorial services said, doing good works, and so on, we beg God not judge the deceased harshly, and in the end, show him mercy.


Alms can be quietly given to your priest if he and his family might be in need, to give alms to the poor and the homeless you might encounter, I can tell you, monks are always grateful for alms, and in monasteries, lots of people send a fairly large sums of money for special food to be served in the refectory in memory of their reposed loved ones on the anniversary of their repose.Many people donate icons, vlessing crosses, chalices and Gospels to their parish, and this is always a much-appreciated gift. As a person quietly gives out his alms, he ask the person to whom he is giving them,to pray for his departed.
For those of us monks who are priests, we are often asked to serve a phanikhida, or trisagion servicd, for which we gratefully receive alms. I
the bsis from Scripture for this is from the book of Tobit,not in the Protestant canon, which says, "the giving of alms covers many sins." All of us wsould hope that when we die, there will be those who will pray to God for us.

I am sure this is more than enough for you right now.

Fr. Averky

This post from Father Averky (Memory Eternal!), is worthy to be revived, not only because it reiterates so many spiritually beneficial teachings of the Church, but also because some of the themes of charity and alms-giving were discussed lately in other threads.