Grapes

[Byron Jack Gaist]

Yesterday (6th August, Feast of the Transfiguration) during the liturgy, the priest blessed some grapes and these were distributed at the end of the service together with the antidoron.

I wonder if someone could clarify the significance of this. Also, an aquaintance commented that Christians should not eat grapes before 6th August. Is this correct, and is this also the reason why wine is not permitted on certain fast days (I thought it was the alcohol)?

Many thanks

In Christ
Byron

[Kosmas Damianides]

Sorry but I think it has nothing to do with Greek Orthodoxy, maybe it's a Serbian Orthodox or Slavic Orthodox tradition?

In Christ

Kosmas

[Leandros Papadopoulos]

This is an ancient Christian custom. The first week of August, on the sixth of August, the farmers use to gather the early fruits of their summer harvest (grapes, figs etc.) and to present them in the Church to be blessed and to give them for free to congregation. These fruits are called the “beginnings”.

In a text from the 7th century (“the laws of the kingdom” by emperor Constantine Porfirogenitos) this custom is described vividly: “The Emperor of Constantinople gathers the “beginnings” (“aparches”) in Chalcedone, where there are many vines, and then he waits for the Patriarch of Constantinople to come on the the Holiday of Transfiguration, to bless the fruits and to personally hand out the grapes to the laymen”.

This custom is honored in many places in Greece where there are plantation with vines.

We must not forget that the Church was presented once as a “vine”. So, Church blesses the first fruits of vine giving a "theological" meaning to farmer’s work.

[Leandros Papadopoulos]

Also, an aquaintance commented that Christians should not eat grapes before 6th August. Is this correct, and is this also the reason why wine is not permitted on certain fast days (I thought it was the alcohol)?

You are right, Byron Jack Gaist, it is custom not to eat the first fruits from vines before the Church bless them.

In old days, the farmers had to give the first fruits for free and then, after the blessing from the Church on the sixth of August, they would have started to sell their harvest.

In the same context, the consumers also waited for the same day, before of which they did not consumed grapes - not even those that were produced from their own fields.

All these, were signs of old times, when the “market” was not following the laws of offer/demand, but when personal relations were ruling over the market place.

At our days we may be considered as fools if we follow these customs.

[Marie-Duquette]

It seems to me that this question of custom versus tradition and Tradition can be very confusing to people of the West who are becoming "Orthodox". And, traditions of various countries/Nations being used in Liturgical or paraliturgical services, without prior or proper explanations to the newly Chrismated or Baptised.

It should be understood that becoming Orthodox does not mean that one becomes Greek, Russian, Serbian, Syrian, etc. but, we do keep our own personal ethnic backgrounds, American, English, Irish, French, Canadian, Italian or other.

Also, the customs of the middleEast or Russia are not those of America or Europe.

Perhaps, individuals should, while respecting the customs of the "Mother Orthodox Countries" shouldn't be made to follow these customs here in America, England, Australia, etc.

As far as I can understand my Christian Faith, The Orthodox Faith is Christian and not specifically Greek, Russian, Serbian or other.

Until ALL Orthodox Churches and People come to understand and live the roots of Orthodoxy and living them in their own environments without mimicking or imitating, while respecting and accepting the customs of others, there will be conflicts of opinions and implementation of so-called Orthodox Customs.

As St. Paul says in one of his epistles, "In Christ there is no East or West, no male or female, Greek or Gentile, ... " We are all ONE in Christ Jesus, called to be so through the Father in the Holy Spirit.

marie_duquette

p.s. Christ Jesus after His resurrection sent his disciple to Baptise all Nations in the Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. He did not send them to make all peoples Greek or Russian, or otherwise.

All baptised into Christ are called to Holiness of Life in Christ.}

[Leandros Papadopoulos]

Dear marie_duquette and forum members,

Do you have any "customs" in your country? Then Christians would turn them into "Christian" customs.

Do you have any real life with personal relation among neighbours? Then Christians would turn this life into blessed Christian Life.

But no customs, means no life. And if there is no life, how should Christian life come forth?

It's up to life to grow in Christ. Do your thing, forget about motherlands.

If we have no customs to pass over to our children, then how are we going to pass over to them Christianity?

Tradition is made within the family, within the village, within the town, within the country and finally tradition/customs is all that Church life is. It is not a methodology; it is all "customs" passed from generation to generation.

We do not have to become another person, but we have to relate with others, and "relating" means to accept to become the object of the habits of the other.

St Paul has said for that:

(1 Corinthians 9:19-23)
"Though I am free and belong to no man, I make myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all men so that by all possible means I might save some. I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings”.

I think God CAN NOT save us in being isolated from the others. (I intentionally use the word CAN). And "others" are "others" as being not us at all. Then, we should try to be "like them", to be in Church with them to share the blessing of the gospel as it is preached to them, even if we are the preachers.

Our denial to become like "them" and to preserve "us" is one of the greatest problems in our spiritual life.

The equation of Jew and Greek, man and woman, slave and free man, means exactly this truth: we have no excuse in denying being like the “other”. The “other” is no more beyond our experience. In Christ we are all ONE.

It is problematic to believe that the equation means that we do need the other. Church does not make “perfect” individuals. Church guides her members to realize the “perfection” of perfect relations with the other persons.

May God bless us, all.

[Marie-Duquette]

Leandros,
Thank you for the "long" post.

Of course, each country has "customs" music, dance, sports, etc.
Yes, in Rome, do as the Romans, in Greece, do as the Greeks. As the saying goes. But, that doesn't mean that The American becomes Greek or Roman. We each have our National Roots and live by them, grafted unto Christ!

There is a difference between traditions and Tradition with a capital "T" . Each family does have customs and traditions. But, as Christians sometimes these customs and traditions, as you say need to be Christianized. As for example, the Christmas Tree in Germany, the Manger in Italy, Even St. Nicholas who is now called Santa claus. Trapeza is nothing more than pot luck dinners. So, I question, Where is the focus in including customs and traditions into the Christian Tradition. I think that secular society has much, much influence upon people in general. And, that hinders the deepening of the Christ Life.

Perhaps here in America, Squash, Beans and Corn could be brought to Church for blessings instead of grapes. Or other vegetable, grains, flowers and fruit. And instead of laurel leaves spread on the Church floor during procession of the Cross, maple or oak could be used! The custom would change exteriorly, but the Spirit would remain.

I am not trying to argue, only trying to understand what you mean, Leandros by "Our denial to become like them and to preserve "us" is one of the greatest problems in our spiritual life."

I have no desire to become Greek or Russian or Syrian, and I do love the "other" and enter into the celebrations ... and, I pray that I become more like Christ Jesus as I read, pray and live the Gospel. Jesus did not shun the Cannonite Woman or the Samaritan Woman or the beggars and lepers, the blind and the paralytics. In ministering to them He did not bring the Jew in himself, though He was born Jewish; but He brought God's Spirit of Love, Compassion and Mercy, healing and joy.

You also say that " traditions/customs is all that the Church Life is! It is not a methodology, is is all "customs" passed from generation to generation."

I find some of your reasoning confusing, to say the least.

Forgive me for miss- understanding your post! That is the difference between Eastern and Western mind and thought process. This doesn't make one more that the other, it doesn't lessen the worth of one or the other in God's eyes. The important question, is "do I love God, my neighbor as my self. Wishing and praying for the good, the peace, the health both spiritual and physical of the other." "Love one another, as I have loved you.! Jesus says. We are called to loose ourselves in Christ not in another National Pride.

There are many questions in my heart and mind on this subject.

forgive me a sinner,
marie_duquette

[nurse-aid]

Finnaly normal answer, marie...thank you...Yes St.Paul said this...that he become like someone that he can save at list some of them...maybe he can say that...but we are not him...so we simply cannot save anyone, BUT CHRIST! so maybe then we do not need become someone and lost ourselves by this...which is ops...very folish then...we are hardly can hold ourselves in the proper condition...Don't you think?

[Byron Jack Gaist]

Thank you all for your posts.

I'm wondering now, if the tradition (or custom, or Tradition, I don't know which it is) of blessing the "first fruits" of the harvest is not perhaps more universal and pan-Christian? I seem to remember, while living in the U.K., noticing some Western Christian churches also doing this (with fruit and cereals if my memory serves me right)...as I was not a regular churchgoer at the time, I'm not sure about this, perhaps someone who is can clarify. Thank you Leandros, for clarifying what the custom is, or was, in Greece.

Also, could someone clarify the theological significance of this act taking place on the Feast of the Transfiguration?

In Christ
Byron

[Theopesta]

dear all, we began the fasting in the name of theotokos in 7th, august for 15 days till the feast of her appearance to the deciples, to see her assompton to heaven (not heaven of heavens)
are you all have this fast in your Tradation?

[John Michael Fowler]

Dear Brother Byron, the festival you are referring to is 'harvest festival' it is in the Anglican and every English schoolboy knows it well. But I think it was invented by a Vicar in Victorian times.
I would like to ask you and other people such as our friends Leandros, Vasilis and Owen, whose ancestors- like mine- must hail from Wales. Do you know of any study which looked at the changes in personality when power is inflicted on someone. I mentioned Roy Meadows in the past, maybe once he was really professional, maybe it was power which changed him. Has any study been made of this? Sorry I don't know how to start a new topic.
Sorry to pollute this site with more non religious talk, maybe I should join a psychology website as well.I would like to thank everyone for their posts I have learnt a lot from everyone. In Christ John

[John Michael Fowler]

Friends, actually I will say with you a story which has nothing to do with psychology.
In London there is a Serbian church, I was in London and nearby, because there are many ethnic shops there. So I thought I would enter. I entered a hall and there was a Chetnik meeting there. I said I was English, that drew some stares, and then I said I was from Birmingham, I was then walked to the door by the priest and bade farewell, the door closed behind me.

Why? Birmingham has a Serbian church as well but it was founded by mainly Nedic supporters?!

I have no link at all with that church save I went there three times about four years ago, I have never spoken with the priest.

So I was turfed out of God's house because I came from the wrong city?!
The stupid thing is actually I have a lot of sympathy with what happened to Mihailovic and the Chetniks and if they would have let me we would have become warm friends.

That is the only time that has ever happened to me!

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

theopesta dem wrote:


dear all, we began the fasting in the name of theotokos in 7th, august for 15 days till the feast of her appearance to the deciples, to see her assompton to heaven (not heaven of heavens)
are you all have this fast in your Tradation?

That's really interesting!

From what you write it seems the Copts (and all Oriental Orthodox also?) are on the Julian Calendar? I often have wondered about this.

Also it seems that if you began a 15 day fast yesterday (August 7- secular date) in preparation for the Feast of the Dormition- another indication you people are on the Julian Calendar- then you are considering only the weekdays (Monday-Friday) as fast days and not the weekends.

For us we begin what we call the Dormition Fast on August 1. If you are on the Julian (Old) Calendar this would begin on August 14 (civil date). If you are on the New Calendar then this began August 1 (civil date).

For us this fast is very strict just as is that of Great lent with fish only being allowed on the Feast of the Transfiguration. Even on weekends which normally is a time of less rigour we only allow wine & oil (not fish as on weekends of the Nativity & Apostles Fast).

In Christ- Fr Raphael

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

Byron asked:


Also, could someone clarify the theological significance of this act taking place on the Feast of the Transfiguration?

In footnote 2 for Canon III of the Canons of the Apostles it says that, "during the festival of the Dormition...they used to offer bunches of grapes to the patriarch...at the end of the divine service. Today however [this is St Nikodemos Agiorite writing in the early 19th c] it is the prevailing custom in most regions for such grapes to be offered at the festival of the Transfiguration of the Saviour, and for them to be offered by the priest."

So it seems this tradition of offering grapes and other first-fruits is ancient & probably it arose simply from the fact that this was the time when these became ripe. The prayer of blessing for the grapes does not actually mention the Feast of Transfiguration or any other Feast.
As to why grapes were not eaten before Transfiguration the Nikolsky Ustav simply says that "the ustav of the Church forbids the eating of new grapes before their blessing on August 6th." Perhaps this is just a matter of blessing that needs to come before consuming!

In Christ- Fr Raphael

[Theopesta]

many thanks our fathers we are as your family:

{For us this fast is very strict just as is that of Great lent }
and we are considering only the weekdays (Monday-Friday) as fast days and not the weekends.

but the people here refuse to eat fish even in the transfiguration. although the church alow,

some or many laity people fasting without any fatty vegitable oil, because they are simply love theotokos by a simple feelings even in saturdays and sundays
in the past many muslims here fast as we and go to everywhere on name of theotokos to be blessed

[Theopesta]

sorry or father I mean by:
{we are considering only the weekdays (Monday-Friday) as fast days and not the weekends}

the saturdays and sundays in any fast we can eat fasted food at any time in the morning no abstaining from food to a certain time and even no prostrations.
we are as you in the the Nativity & Apostles Fast

pray for me
in christ

[Theopesta]

if you please our father can I know where I can find {Canons of the Apostles }
p.s. our tranfiguration in 19th, august

many thanks to you all

[Mother Evfrosinia]

Blessing grapes on Transfiguration is not just a custom or a pious tradition of blessing the first fruits. This tradition has a liturgical significance as grapes provide the wine for the Eucharist. The prayers of blessing are found in the Menaion together with the service for the Feast, and Fr. Kallistos Ware's "Festal Menaion" provides translations of the prayers used in both Greek and Slav usage: "Bless, O Lord, this new fruit of the vine, which Thou hast been pleased to bring to full ripeness through temperate seasons, showers of rain, and calm weather. May we who partake thereof be filled with joy; and upon those who offer this fruit of the vine for use at Thy Holy Table, may it confer forgiveness of sins, through the sacred and holy Body and Blood of Thy Christ, with whom Thou art blessed, together with Thy most holy, good, and life-giving Spirit, now, and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen." and the Slav usage: "O God our Saviour, who wast pleased to call Thine Only-begotten Son, our Lord and God and Saviour Jesus Christ, the Vine, and in Him hast granted us the fruit of immortality: do Thou now bless this fruit of the vine lying here, and make us Thy servants, who eat of it, partakers of the true Vine. Keep our lives from harm and ever give us peace, and adorn us with the eternal gifts of grace that none can take away: at the intercessions of our most pure Lady, the Theotokos and ever-Virgin Mary, and all Thy saints who have pleased Thee down the ages. For Thou art a good God who lovest mankind, and unto Thee, Father without beginning, together with Thine Only-begotten Son and Thy most holy, good, and life-giving Spirit, do we ascribe glory, now and ever, and unto the ages of ages. Amen".
There are explanations and directions accompanying the prayers that indicate that this is an ancient monastic tradition. They say that no one is to partake of grapes before this blessing, including the brothers that care for the vineyards, and if someone does, they are not to eat any grapes all year, until the next harvest. After Transfiguration the brothers are to be served grapes on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays, obviously in remembrance of the Lord's Passion. Figs, dates and other fruits are also to be blessed as they ripen. It was probably decided to bless grapes on Transfiguration rather than on some other day because the feast itself foreshadows and prepares us for the Lord's Passion, as the kontakion tells us: "Thou wast transfigured upon the mountain, and Thy disciples beheld Thy glory, O Christ our God, as far as they were able so to do: that when they saw Thee crucified, they might know that Thy suffering was voluntary, and might proclaim unto the world that Thou art truly the Brightness of the Father.".
However, as grapes do not ripen at the same time everywhere, the Church adapted this tradition in various ways. In some places in the Holy Land, for instance, grapes are blessed on the feast of the prophet Elijah. In Russia, where grapes were not always readily available, apples were more commonly blessed, and Transfiguration is known as "Yablochny Spas", "the Apple Feast of the Saviour". In northern Russia, where even apples weren't ripe by August 6/19, it was traditional to bless peas. Nowadays, when you can buy any sort of fruit or vegetable year round, we've lost the sense of getting a blessing to partake of the first fruits. But we can still try to keep to the spirit of this tradition. In our monastery we bless all sorts of fruit on Transfiguration, but we abstain only from grapes, taking care not to eat grapes of the new harvest until the feast, in keeping with the ancient monastic practise.

[Theopesta]

the coptic in egypt use the starry pharaonic old calender on the ecclesiastical life and feasts we call it the coptic calender, it is the generarl calender in egypt till the 7th, century
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coptic_calendar

[Kosmas Damianides]

I guess living in Australia means that we don't have any grapes for 15th August. http://www.monachos.net/mb/clipart/uhoh.gif Now what do we do? LOL

[Kosmas Damianides]

Now that you mentioned it Leandros, i now remember something on TV about Greeks giving grapes to Church in Greece. I guess being in the sothern hemisphere means that we miss out on this custom.

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

Mother Evfrosynia- Thank you for the detailed information on grapes & the Feast of Transfiguration of the Lord. You wrote: <blockquote><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="3" class="quotetable"><tr><td><p class="qtheader">Quotation:</p><!-quote-!><p class="qtbody">In our monastery we bless all sorts of fruit on Transfiguration, but we abstain only from grapes, taking care not to eat grapes of the new harvest until the feast, in keeping with the ancient monastic practise.</p><!-/quote-!></td></tr></table></blockquote>
Do you mean you bless the grapes on Transfiguration but don&#39;t eat them afterwards? Forgive my misunderstanding.
Please keep me in your holy prayers as I travel to our monastery on Vashon Island tomorrow for their Feast: Christ the Saviour.
In Christ- Fr Raphael

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

Theopesta Dem- The Canons of the Holy Apostles are found in English in The Rudder. I don&#39;t know if these canons are available on-line or not.

[Mother Evfrosinia]

Fr. Raphael, bless! Sorry about not making myself clear. The grape harvest has already begun here in France, and they&#39;re being sold all over the place in the market places and supermarkets. But we don&#39;t buy or eat grapes until the blessing on Transfiguration. Unfortunately, we&#39;re too far up north &#40;Normandy&#41; to grow any of our own, but we have a large orchard, and we bless our apples, pears and quince on Transfiguration. We will be collecting our honey this week and blessing it on the First Feast of the Saviour this Sunday, which the Russians call &#34;Medovyi Spas&#34;, the &#34;Honey Feast of the Saviour&#34;. Have a safe and spiritually profiteable trip!
Kosmas-- I guess everything depends upon when grapes ripen in Australia, but I think it would be very appropriate to bless them sometime during Great Lent, when the Transfiguration actually occured, perhaps on the Sunday of the Cross? But that&#39;s just my personal idea.

[Olga]

My post must have got lost! Here in Australia, at the Russian church I attend, any fruits in season are blessed at the Transfiguration, as grapes are not in season. Similarly, the greenery used to decorate the church at Pentecost is locally obtained from the little farm of one of the parishioners, mainly blue gum &#40;eucalypt&#41; and golden wattle, both native to this country. Also, on Palm Sunday, bunches of bayleaf &#40;laurel&#41; are blessed and handed out to the faithful, whereas the Russian custom &#40;here, at least&#41; bunches of flowers and sticks of pussywillow are blessed and distributed.

[Byron Jack Gaist]

It&#39;s wonderful to hear of all the variety of fruits and vegetables which are blessed in church. I was listening to a recorded talk on the Transfiguration by Bishop Kallistos the other day, when I came across a theological reason for the blessing; apparently it is significant that grapes and other fruit is blessed on this day, because the Transfiguration is a feast which reminds us of the potential there is, not only in the human soul, but also in the human body and in material creation itself, for being washed in Divine light. Bishop Kallistos points to the way the Lord&#39;s body is made transluscent by the light on traditional icons of the Transfiguration, and also the way the light falls not only on the disciples, but also on shrubs and patches of the ground nearby.

It is interesting that in Palestine the blessing occurs on the feast of Elijah, who appeared next to the Lord together with Moses during the Transfiguration, and whose name &#34;Elias&#34; is suggestive of light and of the sun.

Mother Evfrosinia, it is interesting also to hear that the grapes have liturgical significance and are eaten on Monday, Wednesday and Friday in remembrance of the passion, since Bishop Kallistos also makes it clear in his talk that there can be no Transfiguration without the cross.

Bishop Kallistos suggests that the Feast of the Transfiguration would therefore also be an appropriate day of the environment, together with that of September 1st, designated by Patriarch Demetrios.

John Michael Fowler, can you tell us a bit more about the Anglican &#34;harvest festival&#34;? What is it? What does it signify in theology and Christian life for Anglicans? Who is the Victorian vicar who &#34;invented it&#34;, and why did he invent it? Also,on another issue, why do you say we hail from Wales?&#40;!&#41;

As regards the other topic - studies of the effects of inflicted power - could you be more specific? What do you mean by &#34;power inflicted&#34;, under what sort of circumstances? It does sound an interesting topic, though perhaps you are correct in thinking it appropriate for a psychology web-forum. There is a discussion on war going on at this forum currently which it may nevertheless be relevant to.


In Christ
Byron

[nurse-aid]

And I walk and think and talk to myself...who I’m and what is the reason to be and see all of this what’s around me…And I walk and walk and saw all of this, crocked and ugly, as much as it can be…and I was crying and sad, were is that beauty, were is that light and I was upset…Trying to find the golden key, to the Kingdom of perfection, the kingdom of my dream…living in there, happily as it can be…And I spend all my life to go straight…go deep and far…in order to find that Land, but it was no so far…No clue, no trace for that Golden Place…And I got tired, to see all those junk, to fell dirty and lonely, and almost forgot...Forgot what’s the purpose of my journey and why…I’m trying to find something what never was mine…And I was tired and restless, see no more my way…I sit and cry! Lord show me the way…I’m so good and so clean, so much in love…with beauty and perfections, why then I’m here lonely as a dove…why I can’t see any beauty, why I’m so sad, like you are not here…And HE said: I send you my dear to some place…to learn and see, who you are and why you are such a lost…And HE show me the door to the Kingdom of glass, crocked mirror place, full of dust…HE pushed me in, like I’m bad son, look around you, HE said look what you done! And I see myself in those hundreds frames, all ugly and unshaped, without any single trace…trace of Grace, or sight of Love, Light on the face or the hand full of dove…And I saw it is me...in those frames of this place…me in the world…seeing others with no grace…I saw how me, my own, reflects in those frames, frames of souls of others, with no grace! And HE said you see it is you…in others as you see them, ugly as you do…So when you see all those ugly things…don’t blame others, just try to become straight mirror without those things…Because all we are those broken frames, reflecting our image in it, hungered times a day….we are looking in it, and so upset…Were is that beauty we asked, WERE, and we are regret…
So HE said I hope you are learn… that the World is the place of crocked mirrors of our souls…So dear it is not what outside…it is you who you see around, and then don’t cry…restore your own mirror first...Then you’ll see what reflections come first…If it straight and clean then it is easy to see other soul reflecting in your own!
And I went out and I breathe free, my LORD, I know what I missed and what is what!
Clean and polish, take care good, your precious mirror, soul which framed in HIS gold! And when its become so beautiful clean…Oh dear how much reflections will be in it and how beautiful and perfect clear!

[Byron Jack Gaist]

Poetically put, nurse-aid. One Greek author wrote: &#34;when the world is beautiful within you, it will be beautiful around you&#34;. Perhaps this is why we need the uncreated light in our lives.

In Christ
Byron

[Garry Taylor]

Dear Bryon, Elias is a form of Elijah which means &#34;Yahweh&#34; is God, or to use the old fashioned mistaken translation &#34;Jehovah&#34; is God, from the Hebrew Eli &#43; Jah.

Advent blessings!

[Olga]

Dear Garry

Byron is not entirely incorrect in linking the Greek form of Elijah &#40;Elias&#41; with the Greek word for &#34;sun&#34; &#40;Helios&#41;. Written in Greek, both words are very similar. A similar pun is perpetuated in the hymnody for the vigil of St Nicholas of Myra, where numerous word-plays are made on myrrh-Myra, as again, the Greek name of the city &#40;Myron&#41; is the same as that for myrrh.

[Garry Taylor]

Ah, so i understand that this pun is intended in the LXX? though it obviously could not be in the Masoretic text of the OT. Very interesting, please forgive me if i missed the point.

Advent Peace

[Hieromonk Michael]

Dear Byron,

1 October 1843, the Rev. R. S. Hawker, Vicar of Morwenstow in Cornwall, introduced a special service on that Sunday in order to thank God for the harvest. The popular Church of England festival largely derives from this; the practice became widespread and nowadays churches are decorated with corn, fruit, vegetables and produce of all kinds, especially in country parishes. Hawker also reverted to the offering of the Lammas Day bread at the Eucharist. However, there was a much older Harvest Feast, and I wonder whether Hawker was in fact in his mind, merely reviving this in a new form. I have difficulty in imagining that in a largely agricultural economy, there was not some form of thanksgiving for a successful harvest which could mean the difference between relative prosperity and penury if not worse in those days.

Hieromonk Michael

[Byron Jack Gaist]

Dear Fr Michael,

Many thanks for this interesting information. Although the bread and wine are used in our Liturgy, there seems to me to be a continuing affirmation of the fundamental goodness of creation and its relation to the Creator in this simple giving thanks for the harvest. What do others think?

Those of us on the New Calendar are heading up to the weekend with joy and expectation! Warm wishes to all our friends of the Old Calendar...

In Christ
Byron

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

<blockquote><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="3" class="quotetable"><tr><td><p class="qtheader">Quotation:</p><!-quote-!><p class="qtbody">Those of us on the New Calendar are heading up to the weekend with joy and expectation! Warm wishes to all our friends of the Old Calendar... </p><!-/quote-!></td></tr></table></blockquote>

Likewise Byron!
In Christ- Fr Raphael