Priests and beards

[Mary]

I hope this is the right section to post this under. I also haven't done a search yet, to see if this has been discussed before.

The only reason I'm bringing it up is because I've been hearing a lot of displeasure expressed about beardless priests, and this troubles me. I don't know if there's any teaching regarding beards on priests. But it seems to me that you could have a lousy priest who has a wonderful beard and a wonderful priest who has no beard.

Why should it be such a big deal? Personally, I feel that it's worse of the "Pro-beards" - who role their eyes when speaking of the Beardless Ones than it is for the Beardless ones to be beardless. And besides, they may have a genetic or a medical condition that makes it harder or impossible to have a beard!

I've heard that the Pygmies of the Kalahari have no hair on their bodies except for a little bit on top of their heads. (I could be wrong. I've no idea when and where I read/heard that!) But if such is the case, would it mean that such a pygmy could never be ordained a priest?

Thanks for your insights.
Mary.

[Kris]

I hope this is the right section to post this under. I also haven't done a search yet, to see if this has been discussed before.

The only reason I'm bringing it up is because I've been hearing a lot of displeasure expressed about beardless priests, and this troubles me. I don't know if there's any teaching regarding beards on priests. But it seems to me that you could have a lousy priest who has a wonderful beard and a wonderful priest who has no beard.

Why should it be such a big deal? Personally, I feel that it's worse of the "Pro-beards" - who role their eyes when speaking of the Beardless Ones than it is for the Beardless ones to be beardless. And besides, they may have a genetic or a medical condition that makes it harder or impossible to have a beard!

I've heard that the Pygmies of the Kalahari have no hair on their bodies except for a little bit on top of their heads. (I could be wrong. I've no idea when and where I read/heard that!) But if such is the case, would it mean that such a pygmy could never be ordained a priest?

Thanks for your insights.
Mary.

Dear Mary,

I don't think the objection to beardless clergy is quite as superficial as you portray it. It is an objection to a much wider trend (particularly in America) of adopting Western customs, such as disposing of the traditional cassock in favour of anglican suits and dog-collars, shaving off one's beard, cutting one's hair short, etc.

First of all, when people speak unfavourably of beardless clergy, they're objecting to priests shaving off their beards. If they're are incapable of growing a beard for whatever reason, that does not mean they're unfit to join the priesthood.

You are quite right in saying that the length of one's beard does not necessarily correspond to one's competence as a priest. You will often find this sentiment in the writings of people such as Blessed Paisios the Athonite, who warns against such foolish attitudes.

But I don't think that's something "Pro Beards" would disagree with. Their problem has to do with what they feel is a disregard for tradition and an adoption of Western customs with too little discrimination.

The tradition of bearded clergy has its roots in the Old Testament priesthood, who were forbidden to cut the corners of their beard according to Levitical Law. Whilst we are no longer under Mosaic Law as such, this tradition is one that has been carried on, since it was observed by both the Lord and the Apostles (who are always bearded in iconography when depicted as adults).

I believe there are Church canons prescribing beards for clergy, but I'm afraid I don't have references.

Hope this was of some help,

In XC,
Kris

[Father David Moser]

... any teaching regarding beards on priests. But it seems to me that you could have a lousy priest who has a wonderful beard and a wonderful priest who has no beard.
...
I've heard that the Pygmies of the Kalahari have no hair on their bodies except for a little bit on top of their heads. (I could be wrong. I've no idea when and where I read/heard that!) But if such is the case, would it mean that such a pygmy could never be ordained a priest?


The issue isn't beards (and by extension long hair) but simply that we accept what God gives us - whether bearded or beardless, whether our hair grows long or short or not at all.

Fr David Moser

[Olga]

... since it was observed by both the Lord and the Apostles (who are always bearded in iconography when depicted as adults).



A slight correction here, Kris. The three youngest apostles, Philip, Thomas and John, should be depicted as beardless youths in icons, not as bearded men. The exception is St John when he is shown as the Evangelist in his old age, either with his fellow evangelists, or in his cave at Patmos writing the book of Revelation.

[Irene]

Also, a Priest may be beardless or have a very short beard because, unfortunately, he is forced to work in the world to support his Church and his family. Some parishes being too small and too poor to support a Priest and his family.....Irene

[Andrew]

In the Apostolic Constitution, ALL Christian men who were able to were supposed to grow facial hair. It has to do with accepting manliness - women and children don't have facial hair, but men do.

"Men may not destroy the hair of their beards and unnaturally change the form of a man. For the Law says, “You will not deface your beards.” For God the Creator has made this decent for women, but has determined that it is unsuitable for men." Apostolic Constitutions (compiled c.390, E) 7.392. (1)

Saint Clement of Alexandria had a lot to say about this -

How womanly it is for one who is a man to comb himself and shave himself with a razor, for the sake of fine effect, and to arrange his hair at the mirror, shave his cheeks, pluck hairs out of them, and smooth them!…For God wished women to be smooth and to rejoice in their locks alone growing spontaneously, as a horse in his mane. But He adorned man like the lions, with a beard, and endowed him as an attribute of manhood, with a hairy chest--a sign of strength and rule." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.275

"This, then, is the mark of the man, the beard. By this, he is seen to be a man. It is older than Eve. It is the token of the superior nature….It is therefore unholy to desecrate the symbol of manhood, hairiness.” St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.276

"It is not lawful to pluck out the beard, man’s natural and noble adornment." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.277

This is one reason why facial hair is more common in Greece and Eastern Europe than in Western Europe/America.

[RichardWorthington]

Saint Clement of Alexandria had a lot to say about this -

How womanly it is for one who is a man to comb himself and shave himself with a razor, for the sake of fine effect, and to arrange his hair at the mirror, shave his cheeks, pluck hairs out of them, and smooth them!…For God wished women to be smooth and to rejoice in their locks alone growing spontaneously, as a horse in his mane. But He adorned man like the lions, with a beard, and endowed him as an attribute of manhood, with a hairy chest--a sign of strength and rule." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.275


Fascinating quotation!

I have some more in this post - with a nice twist on St Paul's head covering passage (even if I do say so myself!!)

Richard

[Paul Cowan]

But He adorned man like the lions, with a beard, and endowed him as an attribute of manhood, with a hairy chest--a sign of strength and rule." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.275


Though I am more like sasquatch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigfoot), I think the entire Mexican population would object to this physical generalization.

[Olga]

Though I am more like sasquatch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigfoot), I think the entire Mexican population would object to this physical generalization.


As would large numbers of North-East and South-East Asian peoples and Native Americans (North and South), to name but some. Even among Mediterranean Europeans, being vividly hirsute is not necessarily a given. The Greek slang term spanos, meaning a man who cannot grow (or grow enough of) a beard or facial hair, is rather close linguistically to the word Ispanos (Hispanic).

[Paul Cowan]

Well this narrows it down to Arabs and North Africans. I suppose this was the 'known" world of the time, so his characterization only applies to that region since the rest of the planet appears to be hairless.

[Andreas Moran]

Celts are quite hairy!

[Olga]

... as are many Nordic peoples. It must be the Varangian genes which allow Russians to grow such impressive beards.

[Effie Ganatsios]

In the Apostolic Constitution, ALL Christian men who were able to were supposed to grow facial hair. It has to do with accepting manliness - women and children don't have facial hair, but men do.

"Men may not destroy the hair of their beards and unnaturally change the form of a man. For the Law says, “You will not deface your beards.” For God the Creator has made this decent for women, but has determined that it is unsuitable for men." Apostolic Constitutions (compiled c.390, E) 7.392. (1)

Saint Clement of Alexandria had a lot to say about this -

How womanly it is for one who is a man to comb himself and shave himself with a razor, for the sake of fine effect, and to arrange his hair at the mirror, shave his cheeks, pluck hairs out of them, and smooth them!…For God wished women to be smooth and to rejoice in their locks alone growing spontaneously, as a horse in his mane. But He adorned man like the lions, with a beard, and endowed him as an attribute of manhood, with a hairy chest--a sign of strength and rule." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.275

"This, then, is the mark of the man, the beard. By this, he is seen to be a man. It is older than Eve. It is the token of the superior nature….It is therefore unholy to desecrate the symbol of manhood, hairiness.” St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.276

"It is not lawful to pluck out the beard, man’s natural and noble adornment." St. Clement of Alexandria, 2.277

This is one reason why facial hair is more common in Greece and Eastern Europe than in Western Europe/America.


In the past, moustaches in some regions of Greece, were a sign of manliness. A man with no moustache was considered to be someone who had had his manhood taken away from him.

Up here in north Greece the men are fair and don't have a lot of body hair - except for the Pontios of course.

My son once grew a moustache and beard. His moustache was blond, the part of the beard on his chin was a very light brown, and the sides were reddish-brownish.

I never knew moustaches and beards could have three different colours simultaneously. I told him it was best that he shave everything off because there was no way anyone would believe that he hadn't dyed the whole thing..................

I admit though that the thought that most actors - and others - have their bodies waxed seems a little strange to me.
Older actors had no trouble with their body hair - Clark Gable, etc. A man waxing his body seems a womanly thing to do.

The rule is usually that lighter haired people have less hair than darker haired people, but there are exceptions.

It just depends on your genes.

Does anyone remember the posts concerning special coffee cups for those men who have moustaches?

I don't really like moustaches and especially beards, but priests have these for religious reasons I believe and not because they want to look more manly etc.

However, as long as they are neatly trimmed and clean, there can be no objections.

Effie

[Effie Ganatsios]

Something else that I just thought of is that the darker haired rule doesn't apply to Africans and Chinese even though they have dark hair.

As far as I know, these two peoples have very little body hair.

Again, just genes.

Effie

[Margaret S.]

I was reading an essay by Kenneth Rexroth on Martin Buber in which he remarked that Martin Buber had the most authentic beard since Baron von Hugel and all I could think was that Mr Rexroth had never been to an Orthodox monastery. I think the issue with priestly beards though is not so much their 'authenticity' (the idea of an 'authentic beard' had me mightily resisting giggles at church for a while) but, as the first reply said, the bland westernising that tends to go with the lack of them. Fr No-Beard usually wears a grey lounge suit and a funny bit of plastic in his collar and that is gross modernity; even an Anglican clergyman wouldn't have been seen like that before the War (there's a story about Newman that says when he was seen about Oxford in grey trousers everyone knew he had resigned his living because clergy always wore black!) It's as if Protestant/RC clergy are caught in a twilight zone, they seem to want to look like businessmen in their grey suits but something pulls them back so they put plastic inserts in their collars to indicate otherwise. A lot of people find the idea of Orthodox clergy in that position worrying, well at least I do, it's as if looking Orthodox is embarrassing but looking like some kind of generic “guess my denomination” minister is alright.


Regards
Margaret
in Edinburgh

[Isa Almisry]

Well this narrows it down to Arabs and North Africans. I suppose this was the 'known" world of the time, so his characterization only applies to that region since the rest of the planet appears to be hairless.


Well, with the Arabs we have the added problem now that having a beard can mark you as a Muslim, and a shaven face can be an act of difiance to Islamists.

In the interest of full disclosure, I just shaved off my full beard (it takes me less than a month to get one).

[Matthew]

Also, a Priest may be beardless or have a very short beard because, unfortunately, he is forced to work in the world to support his Church and his family. Some parishes being too small and too poor to support a Priest and his family.....Irene

Would this be true of a Deacon?

Do most Deacons face the same expectation of wearing a beard?

[Herman Blaydoe]

Would this be true of a Deacon?

Do most Deacons face the same expectation of wearing a beard?

Like with many Orthodox "policies", it depends on which jurisdiction. My Metropolitan says beards are "not necessary".

Herman the bearded Pooh

[D. W. Dickens]

Why does St Paul think that men with long hair or covering their heads are bad? I hate to be so clumsy about it, but perhaps we're just connecting with the later fashion (and I don't mean that in a bad way) of the Empire. I'm not saying that if it's fashion it's superficial or should be ignored, but it might bring a way of discussing these things.