Canons and canon law

[Florianos]

God bless!+

It would be interesting to write about the church canons , the canonical law and their keeping today!

Do we have to hold all the canons? And what happens when the canons are broken or generally not kept?

In CHRIST

[M.C. Steenberg]

Dear Alexander and others,

You may wish to spend some time with the 'Search' function of the forum, as this topic was much discussed a few months ago. You will likely find some good food for thought to start you off, in that previous discussion (among others, as it's been a recurring theme over the years).

INXC, Matthew

[Paul Cowan]

Canon LXIV.
If any clergyman or layman shall enter into a synagogue of Jews or heretics to pray, let the former be deposed and let the latter be excommunicated.


I have read other threads dealing with praying with non-OC ie; at funerals, weddings and the like and we should by all means not cause offense to others. Are these the same as "Praying" with or are these just "praying" with others? I can see the difference of celebrating a communion with them and we should not partake of it, but at what point does prayer and I am using the word "Amen" to equate to praying with others draw the line?

If I go to my mother's Methodist church at Christmas and they are singing Christmas songs and the pastor says prayers and I say "Amen" is this cause for excomunication? or if I just keep my mouth shut but still sitting in the pews cause for excommunication? OR have we gotten to the point we don't observe this canon anymore?

I know a man in my parish who loves Jesus with all his heart and speech and he tells me he frequently (occassionally) attends mosques and other faiths on Sunday instead of attending our church and talks about Jesus to them all. He is accepted in their company. Where is the line drawn?
Paul

[Father David Moser]

A very popular term in ecumenical circles or in professional religious circles (such as hospital chaplaincies) is "faith community". Let's take this term and use it to address the question. To "enter into a synagogue ... to pray" could be restated as "entering into another faith community and participating in their worship". When we visit other "faith communities" we need not become a member of the community. We need not adopt their prayers as our own, we need not identify ourselves with them. We pray what we believe - our prayers express our beliefs. When we join in the prayers of heretics or others we adopt their prayers, expressing their heretical ideas, as our own. Just being in the presence of someone praying is not "praying with" them, nor is praying at the same time and in the same place "praying with" them. I would be hesitant to suggest that anyone adopt the words and spirit of a heterodox or other prayer as their own. When you sing a Protestant hymn or give a hearty "amen" to the prayer of a non-Orthodox person, do you know what you are saying? do you know to what you are agreeing? These are vital considerations in drawing the line of "praying with" someone, entering into their community and becoming part of it. It is better, in such a situation, to pray your own prayers along side theirs or to invite them into your prayers (which you know are Truth) - don't become a part of their "community" but invite them to be a part of yours.

On a very practical level, I would suggest that you refrain from the consenting "Amen" on one hand, but on the other it is certainly acceptable to maintain your own prayers "in parallel" as it were with theirs. My extended family is not Orthodox - but when we are all together various family members will take the lead in offering the family prayers (such as at meal times). In such situations, as the other person is praying, I quietly pray as I have been taught, praying "in parallel" but not "with" the rest of the family.

Fr David Moser

[Ioannis Freeman]

Father David's advice shows wisdom and tenacity, in my opinion. It is wise because it divides praying the same prayer(s) as non-Orthodox believers from praying along-side and contemporaneous with them. His advice is tenacious because it provides practical ways to love our neighbors while retaining the integrity of who we are in Christ.

My suggestion would be the creation of videos to show situations from everyday life, such as the scene of praying before a meal with people who are not Orthodox, so that Orthodox Christians could put Father David's wisdom and tenacity into practice.--Ioannis

[Jason H.]

Here is a listing of the 7 Ecumenical Councils and their Canons:

http://www.holytrinitymission.org/books/english/councils_ecumenical_rudder.htm

[Jason H.]

Fr. David is spot on. Do not adopt the heretical expressions of the heterodox but maintain your faith. I only give two exceptions to going to a non-Orthodox service and that is marriages and funerals. Other than that, I will not participate or go to any other denomination.