'Shopping the monastic market'

[David Naess]

Should a person considering a monastic life just go to the most convenient monastary or should they "shop the market," see what work is done at the various monastries and try to zero in on monastaries where his specific talents might be put to the best use?

I assume that a novice monk will probably spend quite a few years just learning the basics and acquiring the right mindset. Do monks get reassigned by the Diocese to wherever they are most needed/can be of maximum benefit --or do they enter a single monastary and remain there or within the group of monastaries associated with it?

[Father David Moser]

Should a person considering a monastic life just go to the most convenient monastary or should they "shop the market," see what work is done at the various monastries and try to zero in on monastaries where his specific talents might be put to the best use?

Both. You should certainly visit the monasteries most convenient to you, however, it is also good to seek out the advice of someone who has experience in monastic life and ask for suggestions of where else to visit.

One of my parishioners, contemplating the monastic life looked at a variety of monasteries and then spoke with our Archbishop on one of his archpastoral visits to ask about monastic life and various monasteries. He made some suggestions and offered his thoughts on the places that she was considering. This advice helped her to find an appropriate place.

Fr David Moser

[Father Anthony]

I would also have to concur with Father David on his advice above. Monasticism is a way of life, God-willing for the rest of your life. You have to be able to live with those in community with you and to also know what would be expected of you. This can only come about speaking with your spiritual father and the respected abbots/abesses of the communities you are looking at.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+

[Antonios]

Dear brother in Christ David,

To add to the important advice given by Father David and Father Anthony, below is from the book 'The Arena' written by Bishop Ignatius (Brianchaninov):

Chapter 5

While basing our life on the commandments of the Gospel, at the same time we should choose for our place of residence a monastery as far removed from occasions of sin as possible... Causes or occasions of sin are the following: wine, women, wealth, health of body when excessive, authority or power, and honour or fame and name. 'These', says St. Isaac the Syrian, 'are not sins in themselves, but on account of our weakness and as our nature is easily drawn by them to various sins, there is need of peculiar caution in regard to the them.'

The Fathers forbid postulants to choose a monastery that is famous in the eyes of worldly people. The vainglory the whole monastery shares must inevitably infect each individual member as well. Experience shows that all the brethren of a community can be infected with the spirit of vainglory, not only on account of the material privileges or superiority of their monastery, but also on account of the high opinion of lay people concerning the special piety of its rule. Hence arises scorn for the brethren of other communities, which implies pride, and this saps the possibility of progress or success in the monastic life which is based on love for our neighbours and humility towards them.

[Herman Blaydoe]

In addition, as you are deciding if a monastery is right for you, the abbot must also decide if you are right for this particular monastery.

[Andreas Moran]

The monastic life is probably impossible in England where there is only one monastery, and that not typical.

[M.C. Steenberg]

But let us also remember that monastic has at its root 'solitude', 'solitary'. When no monasteries existed in Christendom, one man went into the desert. Where no monasteries exist, this still at times takes place.

INXC, dcn Matthew

[Andreas Moran]

Indeed, but by 'monastic life', I meant life in a male or female monastery - however small - which follows the usual cycle of services, feasts and fasts. There is nowhere in the UK like that. I suggested, as much as I dared, to the Lavra Fathers to think of a skete, perhaps in Scotland, but I don't think it will happen. I regret that Orthodoxy here has no monastic foundation, support and 'backup' of the kind that is normal in Russia, Cyprus and Greece, underpinning the spiritual life there. Over the Christmas vacation in Russia, it will be a case of trying to decide which monasteries, in addition to the Lavra, to visit. Thank God we have the blessing of the presence here of Elder Sophrony.

[Kris]

Indeed, but by 'monastic life', I meant life in a male or female monastery - however small - which follows the usual cycle of services, feasts and fasts. There is nowhere in the UK like that. I suggested, as much as I dared, to the Lavra Fathers to think of a skete, perhaps in Scotland, but I don't think it will happen. I regret that Orthodoxy here has no monastic foundation, support and 'backup' of the kind that is normal in Russia, Cyprus and Greece, underpinning the spiritual life there. Over the Christmas vacation in Russia, it will be a case of trying to decide which monasteries, in addition to the Lavra, to visit. Thank God we have the blessing of the presence here of Elder Sophrony.

There was the St. Edward Brotherhood in Surrey. It's very small, but otherwise typical in terms of its cycle of services, feasts and fasts, etc.

But they now belong to the Cyprianite synod following the ROCOR - Moscow reunion.

[Andreas Moran]

Yes, that's the problem - they are hardly in communion with anybody, and anyway, how could we go anywhere which rejected MP?

[David Naess]

OK...

How about part 2 of my original post?

Once a person becomes a monastic, are they under the exclusive auspices of the abbot, the bishop, the jurisdiction or what?

i.e.; Are they in the one monastery for good or are they subject to transfer?

It doesn't make any difference...
I'm just trying to find out how the system works.

[Herman Blaydoe]

Actually it makes a great deal of difference. When you visit and evaluate a monastery, they must also evaluate you, to see if you fit in with their discipline and liftstyle. Monasticism is not formalized like in Catholicism, with different orders, but there is not a lot of uniformity either. This is not a decision anyone generally makes after simply one visit to one monastery. You would do well to visit several. Lengthy stays, if necessary, can generally be worked out with the abbot on a case-by-case basis. Try it and see. The "noviciate" status may last several months or even several years, depending. If one monastery turns out to not be right for you, then you may well try another. Even after initial vows, when one becomes a riassophore monk, you are not "obligated". But once you become a "schema" monk, I believe you are expected to "stay put", but even then there have been notable exceptions.

There is a lot of good information at this website and at: Orthodox Monasteries of North Anerica (http://omna.malf.net).

[Father David Moser]

Once a person becomes a monastic, are they under the exclusive auspices of the abbot, the bishop, the jurisdiction or what?

i.e.; Are they in the one monastery for good or are they subject to transfer?


A simple monk usually would not be "subject to transfer" once he has been accepted into the monastic brotherhood (tonsured into the small schema). It is possible for the ruling bishop to request that a senior monk be released from his monastery to engage in some particular task for which he is well suited - such as providing a foundation for a new monastic community. Also an ordained monk (hierodeacon, hieromonk, abbot, archimandrite) is "under obedience" to his bishop as well and thus has to balance the two authorities. Look at the life of the Optina Elder St Anthony who was transferred by the synod to take up the labor of superior at a different monastery late in life, although he would have preferred to remain at Optina skete. The "check and balance" that exists though is that the monastic brotherhood would probably have to agree to release the monk for that transfer to take effect.

Fr David Moser