Will Satan be saved?

[Justin Farr]

I have read that God is so loving that the demons and even Satan himself can be saved, even if it was insanely unlikely he would ever repent and such.

Is this true? If so, that's is pretty cool. I mean, that truly shows how loving God is...

[Jonathan Michael]

There are a number of Church Fathers who write about hope in universal restoration: St Gregory of Nyssa, St Issac the Syrian, Origen (but then Origen wrote a lot of things, and some aren't accepted by the Church), and St. Silouan the Athonite. These speak primarily about the universal restoration of man, and are an expression of hope, just as the prayers at Pentecost for those in Hell are also an expression of love and hope. As an aside, I don't think any heterodox churches publicly pray for those in Hell as the Orthodox do, often teaching that once you're in Hell that's it; another example for the compassion and practical love in the Orthodox faith.

Anyway, that's universal restoration of man. Of the Satan and the demons, St Issac the Syrian in particular did write about hope for the salvation of the entire cosmos (which I think would include fallen angels).

"I am of the opinion that He is going to manifest some wonderful outcome, a matter of immense and ineffable compassion on the part of the glorious Creator, with respect to the ordering of this difficult manner of Gehenna's torment."

Bishop Kallistos of Diokleia relates a story about having to go on a long journey with a bishop, many years ago before he was ordained. He decided to stimulate debate and conversation for the journey by asking the bishop what he thought about the idea of Satan's restoration: could Satan be saved?
As the journey started, the young Kallistos asked his question: "could Satan be saved?" The bishop replied without hesitation: "Mind your own business."

God became man, so that man could become God. Our salvation, and so the restoration of the natural world, is dependant upon Our Lord Jesus Christ. Satan is not human, his fall was seperate and before Adam's, and so his restoration and relationship with God is not really our concern, being more than likely beyond our ken. Satan's relationship with us is more important, and in that he is our oppressor and opponent.

Well, I hope the above doesn't sound like I'm criticizing your question - I have no authority to do that, but these are the things that I've been taught. In addition they are just my thoughts and are very certainly open to correction.

But one thing I am very sure of, what we do know of God is that His compassion is infinite.

[Father David Moser]

One fact that "complicates" this issue is that Satan is not a man - Satan is an angelic being. We don't really know anything about the angels or their ability (or inability) to repent and so whenever we talk about Satan repenting, we are really anthopormophizing Satan and thinking of him as a man like us (which he is not).

Fr David Moser

[Nina]

One fact that "complicates" this issue is that Satan is not a man - Satan is an angelic being. We don't really know anything about the angels or their ability (or inability) to repent and so whenever we talk about Satan repenting, we are really anthopormophizing Satan and thinking of him as a man like us (which he is not).

Fr David Moser

Yes. Elder Paisios used to pray for the Devil, until one day Elder Paisios saw him laughing outside in a distance from his cell and I think ridiculing the Elder. From that day the Elder stopped praying for the repentance of the Devil, since he understood that it was futile.

[Moses Ibrahim]

Yes. Elder Paisios used to pray for the Devil, until one day Elder Paisios saw him laughing outside in a distance from his cell and I think ridiculing the Elder. From that day the Elder stopped praying for the repentance of the Devil, since he understood that it was futile.

Yes, the demon was making funny faces and mocking a monk who prayed to God to save the devil and his demons. The monk realized that God would save the devil if only the devil and his demons would repent.

Christians however, try to get up when they fall into a bottomless pit of sins. God sees this and that is why He will find any excuse to save His people, for God does not wish to destroy His creation but to save it. And any act of repentance among His people,the Lord Jesus Christ will use as a means to justify in front of His Heavenly Father and remit the sins of even the worst and wretched sinners. And this is why many Saints and Fathers tell us that many people are saved on their deathbeds. (i.e. St. Dismas the wise thief on the cross) this is not my own teaching but those of the Holy Fathers of our Church... forgive me if I mis-represented the Fathers of the Church and to those who know what is Truth please correct any mistakes I made.

[Isaac Crabtree]

While I am certain that God saves those who repent, and forgives unto the uttermost, we should not use this as an excuse for laxity. St. John Klimakos mentions something like this, calling the thought of God's ineffable mercy (as a temptation prior to a spiritual fall) a "cur" that we should not heed. Likewise the thought of God's inexorable judgment was not good for the thought-life of someone who had just fallen.

Won't it be about our hearts, anyway? Yes, our deeds help to change us and actualize our faith, but doesn't God see the heart? If I fast twice a week and tithe everything I have but I condemn others, then nothing I have done is doing me any good. Likewise, if I have fallen greatly but offer sorrowful, humble repentance and pledge to do better with His help, I will go down from the temple justified, by the Lord's own promise.

[Evan]

Although I am aware that certain of the Fathers have speculated otherwise and thus feel uncomfortable taking an unequivocal position on this point, we have it on good authority that it is not with the angels that God is concerned, but with the seed of Abraham. I find Tertullian's articulation of the importance of this distinction, and its negative consequences for the devil and his angels to be quite compelling:

"But Christ, they say, bare (the nature of) an angel. For what reason? The same which induced Him to become man? Christ, then, was actuated by the motive which led Him to take human nature. Man's salvation was the motive, the restoration of that which had perished. Man had perished; his recovery had become necessary. No such cause, however, existed for Christ's taking on Him the nature of angels. For although there is assigned to angels also perdition in the fire prepared for the devil and his angels, yet a restoration is never promised to them. No charge about the salvation of angels did Christ ever receive from the Father; and that which the Father neither promised nor commanded, Christ could not have undertaken."

From "On the Flesh of Christ"

In Christ,
Evan

[Jesse Dominick]

my understanding is that the angels and demons exist in aeonic time, which is not like our time. they have free will, but it has been stabilized ever since the fall of the angels - the angels are stabilized in serving God and the demons are stabilized in fighting against Him. St. John Climacus said the angels cannot fall, and the demons cannot repent. i think if we posited the possibility of repentance for the demons, then we would have to posit that more angels could fall at some point too.

[Aidan Kimel]

Metropolitan Kallistos tells the story how he once asked a Greek archbishop about the possible salvation of Satan:


If it is possible that the devil, who must surely be a very lonely and unhappy person, may eventually repent and be saved, why do we never pray for him? To my disappointment (for I could not at the moment think of other topics of conversation), the archbishop settled the matter with a sharp and brief rejoinder: "Mind your own business." He was right. So far as we humans are concerned, the devil is always our adversary; we should not enter into any kind of negotiations with him, whether by praying for him or in other ways. His salvation is quite simply none of our business. But the devil has also his own relationship with God, as we learn from the prologue of the book of Job, when Satan makes his appearance in the heavenly court among the other "sons of God" (Job 1:6-2:7). We are, however, altogether ignorant of the precise nature of this relationship, and it is futile to pry into it. Yet, even though it is not for us to pray for the devil, we have no right to assume that he is totally and irrevocably excluded from the scope of God's mercy. We do not know.

One thing I do know: prayer for the devils is beyond me personally. I am too weak, too vulnerable. I must leave such prayer to the saints.

[Brian Patrick Mitchell]

Great quote. Thanks, Father.

[Darlene Griffith]

Oh brother, not this again is all I can say. What does Holy Scripture say is the end of the devil and his minions? Is it not clear? Is there not a place that has been prepared for the devil and his angels or is the Bible just a fairy tale? This nonsense of praying for Satan is just nonsense. Do you not see how ridiculous it is? Our Lord Jesus Christ, who could have prayed for the devil, whose prayers God the Father would have most certainly heard, DID NOT pray for the devil. Nor did our Lord Jesus Christ ever once instruct his disciples or Apostles to pray for the devil. Nor do we when we enter our most Holy House of prayer, when gathered at the Divine Liturgy and mystically ascending to Heaven with the saints and in the presence of the Holy Trinity pray for the devil and his demons.

Since Christ our Lord never prayed for the devil and his demons, and in fact resisted the devil for 40 days rebuking him and leaving that place victoriously, then proceeded to defeat him in hell for all eternity and wrentched the keys of death from his wicked abode and possession, then we must follow our Lord's lead and consider his fate sealed - period. We should not contemplate or ever consider praying for the devil and his demons. To suggest such, to plant such erroneous concepts into the mind of a believer in Jesus Christ whose enemy is the very devil himself, (meaning the devil is our Lord's enemy as well as ours), or to even subtly imply that the matter of the fate of the arch-enemy of our Lord Jesus is still somehow uncertain, is misleading and deceptive.

I look forward to that Day when our Lord casts the devil and his demons into the place of utter darkness where weeping and gnashing of teeth will occur. I have no sympathy for the devil though some of you may join in with the Rolling Stones if you wish.

[Cecilie Nielsen]

In my humble opinion I would like to add that the one who tries to pray for the devil and the demons will be doubly persecuted by him and go through unnecessary trouble. Isn't life full enough of challenges as it is? He will ridicule, mock and bother that person. I think it's more profitable for our own salvation and that of our fellow human beings if we concentrate on just that: our own salvation and that of our fellow human beings. :)

[Brian Patrick Mitchell]

The problem with online discussions is that people come at them from all levels — some weak, some strong; some knowledgeable, some not; some serious, some not so serious. Pardon me for not taking this particular thread very seriously.

[Kosta]

That demons will be saved is anathemized by the 6th ecumenical council.

[Dova Nisavic]

I have read that God is so loving that the demons and even Satan himself can be saved, even if it was insanely unlikely he would ever repent and such.

Is this true? If so, that's is pretty cool. I mean, that truly shows how loving God is...

Who wants he will be saved.
Devil does not want to be saved.

[Bryan J. Maloney]

I look forward to that Day when our Lord casts the devil and his demons into the place of utter darkness where weeping and gnashing of teeth will occur. I have no sympathy for the devil though some of you may join in with the Rolling Stones if you wish.

I am sorry to say that I am not so exalted as to look forward to the day when any being is cast into the place of utter darkness. If I can gleefully anticipate it for even the Devil, it would be too small a step to also gleefully anticipate it for my fellow man. I have not the level of perfection and discernment to avoid that possibility were I to take that risk.

[Darlene Griffith]

I am sorry to say that I am not so exalted as to look forward to the day when any being is cast into the place of utter darkness. If I can gleefully anticipate it for even the Devil, it would be too small a step to also gleefully anticipate it for my fellow man. I have not the level of perfection and discernment to avoid that possibility were I to take that risk.

Bryan,

Exalted? To look forward to the Day when the devil and his minions get their just retribution, when God's reckoning comes upon them is an attitude that corresponds with Holy Scripture. This is one enemy in whose final destiny we can rejoice in. Satan has destroyed millions of lives, has been the cause of sin, disease, death, and untold suffering. He is the enemy of our Lord Jesus Christ and as such is our enemy. There is no salvation for Satan.

It is a distorted comparison to suggest that if one rejoices in the destruction of the devil that one must also rejoice in the destruction of his fellow man. The two do not even come close. And furthermore, to think that as you say, it is "cool" that Satan could be saved is utterly distorted.

[Herman Blaydoe]

Distorted or not, there is more than one sainted opinion within historical Orthodoxy on the issue, and there is no "official" dogmatic position held by the whole Orthodox Church on the subject. If someone thinks that satan can be saved, they will not be denied communion because of it AFAIK.

Herman the somewhat distorted Pooh

[Bryan J. Maloney]

It is a distorted comparison to suggest that if one rejoices in the destruction of the devil that one must also rejoice in the destruction of his fellow man. The two do not even come close. And furthermore, to think that as you say, it is "cool" that Satan could be saved is utterly distorted.

Please quote specifically wherein I stated that it was "cool" that Satan could be saved. You are willing to put words into my mouth and make false accusations against me. Why should I take you, then, as a spiritual elder, an example to emulate in gleefully anticipating that any being at all be damned?

[Rick H.]

Bryan wrote:

"I am sorry to say that I am not so exalted as to look forward to the day when any being is cast into the place of utter darkness. If I can gleefully anticipate it for even the Devil, it would be too small a step to also gleefully anticipate it for my fellow man."

This is a valid point. Yes a very small step.

[Nina]

Guys, guys: God, Who created Eosphoros the Angel who rebelled and became the Devil, loves him and us more than we are capable of loving. Now it is ok to love. But we can never love more than God. The Creator loves his creatures more than the creatures can love other creatures. So our command is to love God with all our might and also to love our neighbor. What God does it is His job; and we can't usurp the job of God. Many Fathers when people ask such questions tell them that we do not love others more than God loves them so we must stop reacting this way. Our duty is to love each other. :)

[Darlene Griffith]

Please quote specifically wherein I stated that it was "cool" that Satan could be saved. You are willing to put words into my mouth and make false accusations against me. Why should I take you, then, as a spiritual elder, an example to emulate in gleefully anticipating that any being at all be damned?

Forgive me Bryan. I am so sorry. I confused you with someone else (the original poster) and in doing so offended and sinned against you. Perhaps Fr. Dcn Brian Patrick has said the wisest of all comments here, "Pardon me for not taking this particular thread very seriously."

I do ask though, is Kosta's statement that he made in comment #14 correct? Did the sixth ecumenical council do such a thing?

At the end of it all, after all has been said, I can never pray for Satan to be saved. Such a thing is abhorrent to my heart and soul.

[Antonios]

I think we should be spending our time worrying about our own eternal judgment then that of satan. He will get his just rewards, as will we.

[Kosta]

I do ask though, is Kosta's statement that he made in comment #14 correct? Did the sixth ecumenical council do such a thing?


OOPS, it was the 5th ecumenical council. The anathemas of Justinian against Origen:

VII.
If anyone says or thinks that Christ the Lord in a future time will be crucified for demons as he was for men, let him be anathema.

IX.
If anyone says or thinks that the punishment of demons and of impious men is only temporary, and will one day have an end, and that a restoration (ἀποκατάστασις) will take place of demons and of impious men, let him be anathema.

[Christian Paul]

Peace to all!

It is clear that Satan and the demons will never be saved from eternal damnation. First it is heresy to think otherwise going against the Doctrine of Christ Jesus our Precious and Merciful Lord. Let us hear what He says:

28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; 29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.” (Holy Gospel of Mark chap.3)


Here Christ warns us of the dangers of judging wrongly and mistaken the Action of the Holy Spirit for the action of the devil... That is why many so-called Christians will be condemned for having wrongly accuse what was the Action of God Himself, as the Pharisees did in the time of Jesus and still do against now the Church:

24 Now when the Pharisees heard it they said, “This fellow does not cast out demons except by Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.” (Matthew 12)


The unpardonable sin is unpardonable because of its very nature which is the rejection of the Mercy of God which would have given the accused to be forgiven... Mistaken the Spirit of Truth for the spirit of lies cuts out the Unpardonable Sinner from the Kingdom of Heaven having rejected the Mercy which would have pardon him... For it is by the Spirit of Truth that all men are saved for He is the Giver of Life. Without the Spirit of Truth no one can enter the Heavens... Without the Living Faith meaning without Christ and His Holy Spirit in us no one can dare to enter the Eternal Dwellings...

Now by extension if men guilty of the blaspheme of the Holy Spirit can not escape eternal damnation then a fortiori the demons can not for they blaspheme continuously the Spirit of Truth by being spirit of lies which are Anti-spirit of Light and Love. Also Revelation is clear:

10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. (Revelation 20)

[Zechariah C.]

Here's a good reference:



"IX. If anyone says or thinks that the punishment of demons and of impious men is only temporary, and will one day have an end, and that a restoration (ἀποκατάστασις) will take place of demons and of impious men, let him be anathema." - The Fifth Ecumenical Synod, The Anathematisms of the Emperor Justinian Against Origen



EDIT: I'm sorry. I just realized someone else posted this already.

[Ioan]

It's not that Satan can't repent, it is that he does not repent. The situation revolves around the fact that God does not force anybody to love Him, and that some individuals, starting with satan, actually do decide to truly and freely hate God. It is not exactly a rational decision to hate God, but rather a change of heart against God and Truth, and should one desire such a thing, nobody, not even God can stop a person from doing it. Sad reality is that being evil cannot lead to anything positive, but astonishingly, those who are evil choose to not care about it. So, one cannot end up being evil by accident, or by making an error -- God who is All-Caring would not allow that; it is rather a deliberate, conscious and permanent moving of one's entire will and person towards evil. So, the existence of evil should never trouble us to a point where we lose hope in God's Help; this is exactly what evil wants, and why wouldn't it, since that's its sole preoccupation? So, evil must be treated with indifference as The Fathers teach.

[Aidan Kimel]

"This raises an interesting question, which I once put to a Greek archbishop at the beginning of a hour-hour car journey, in the hope that it would help while away the time. If it is possible that the devil, who must surely be a very lonely and unhappy person, may eventually repent and be saved, why do we never pray for him? To my disappointment (for I could not at the moment think of other topics of conversation), the archbishop settled the matter with a sharp and brief rejoinder: 'Mind your own business.'"

— Met. Kallistos Ware, The Inner Kingdom

[Herman Blaydoe]

There is this continuing perception problem, most prominent among Protestants, that if only I explain it right, people will simply see the error of their ways and accept Christ, I mean, what other possible response could there be? Go to Heaven or Burn in Hell, seems like an obvious choice right?

They forget that there are people out there who say "better to rule in hell than serve in Heaven!" There are those who simply refuse to acknowledge that they sin, that there is any need to change who they are. There are those who simply don't want to put in the time and effort necessary because "easy is the way ..."

The bishop is wise. I haven't finished MY race, now is not the time for me to worry whether or not satan will finish his. But then again, perhaps he has already "finished" his race at this point. If you decide to quit running, you are "finished", yes?

Herman the not quite finished yet Pooh

[James Kiricov]

Not sure on the others, but as I understand it, Origen merely wondered about if that would be possible, and it was taken to be his positive stand which I don't think it was. I think it's ok to wonder about such things, that is what we are doing now. It would take a incredible amount of Love for such a thing and I honestly do not know if that is even possible. I am not overly concerned with such matters as I place my trust in God that every thing will be done fairly and justly.

[Ilaria]

Though I totally agree that there is no point for us, the way we are, minding about the possible saving of the demons, I would like to emphasize shortly a story from the Desert Fathers: in a monastery, a certain nun had this obedience: to ring the bells for the matins; however, a demon mocked her several times, ringing the bells randomly; so, once she stood there to see, and when he appeared she tied him up! furthermore, she made him say "God have mercy"; at the moment he succeeded, suddenly turned the demon into an angel and fled to Heaven.
I thought that God, in His great mercy, revealed to us this story, for our mindful minds, to know that for Him everything is possible!!!

[Isaac Crabtree]

Yes, but where is this story from? A reliable thing or simply a parable told to say to us not to despair?
Also, it seems to me that pondering about whether Satan will be saved means that we think in our hearts that we have it pretty much "made in the shade" with our own salvation. If after all, Lucifer, Beelzebub, the Serpent and Leader of Demons is going to get an 11th Hour Pardon, then Steve the computer programmer who drinks too much and hits his girlfriend doesn't have a thing to worry about, and far less does the average Orthodox Christian.

[Ioan]

The story is definitely made up. It's supposed to emphasize what the demons would have to do in order to repent; it is even funny because it also reveals their absurd stubbornness. Demons don't repent, it's not that they can't, it's that they don't want to. There is a canon against those who believe the devil can (does/will) repent -- an anathema.

[Ilaria]

The story is indeed from the Desert Fathers, I have no time now to give the exact details but I know also that Fr Cleopa did mention it - he had a word about a patience and obedience and he emphasized the patience of the nun, I hardly believe that fr Cleopa would speak about made up stories...

[Ioan]

The story is indeed from the Desert Fathers, I have no time now to give the exact details but I know also that Fr Cleopa did mention it - he had a word about a patience and obedience and he emphasized the patience of the nun, I hardly believe that fr Cleopa would speak about made up stories...

Of course, Fr. Cleopa said it as a made-up story, else he'd be anathema. Why wouldn't you believe Fr. Cleopa would say made-up stories? He'd routinely say funny things and parables. We need to think outside of the box a bit, or else we fall pray to the spirit of over-correctness.

[Isaac Crabtree]

I am with Mr. Ioan on this. The story conveys truth even if not factually true. However, the truth of the story is not about how demons will be saved or that it's really easy to live like a demon and then ask God for mercy later on. The truth is about how merciful God is, how patient, and how absurdly stubborn the devils are. God holds no grudges, and His mercy endures forever. Even His "anger" is the love of a parent, His "wrath" our own refusal to love Him, and the effects that result.

I have another story like this one, perhaps also from the desert fathers. I read it awhile ago and it goes something like this:

A hermit had defeated the demon who had come to attack him, and had bound him with the Sign of the Cross. The foul demon begged to be let go, but the hermit insisted first that the demon sing the song it had used to glorify God in Heaven. The demon refused, saying that he would not do it, and besides that the ascetic could not bear to hear it for long, so powerful as it was, before he would die. The ascetic persisted, and finally the demon began to sing it, first softly with hesitation, trying to remember, but gradually it became surer and more and more powerful. By the end, the demon had once again been transfigured back into the angel he once had been, but the ascetic had died from hearing the glorious power of such a heavenly song.

If someone remembers the source of this, I'd appreciate knowing it.

[Ioan]

I am with Mr. Ioan on this. The story conveys truth even if not factually true. However, the truth of the story is not about how demons will be saved or that it's really easy to live like a demon and then ask God for mercy later on. The truth is about how merciful God is, how patient, and how absurdly stubborn the devils are. God holds no grudges, and His mercy endures forever. Even His "anger" is the love of a parent, His "wrath" our own refusal to love Him, and the effects that result.

I have another story like this one, perhaps also from the desert fathers. I read it awhile ago and it goes something like this:

A hermit had defeated the demon who had come to attack him, and had bound him with the Sign of the Cross. The foul demon begged to be let go, but the hermit insisted first that the demon sing the song it had used to glorify God in Heaven. The demon refused, saying that he would not do it, and besides that the ascetic could not bear to hear it for long, so powerful as it was, before he would die. The ascetic persisted, and finally the demon began to sing it, first softly with hesitation, trying to remember, but gradually it became surer and more and more powerful. By the end, the demon had once again been transfigured back into the angel he once had been, but the ascetic had died from hearing the glorious power of such a heavenly song.

If someone remembers the source of this, I'd appreciate knowing it.


According to Romanian Elder Cleopa Ilie who told this story, it is from a book called Evergetinos that this story was taken from.
Here is a link about this book: http://easternorthodoxlibrarian.blogspot.com/2008/10/evergetinos.html