Relics of the saints

[Andreas Moran]

I wonder if anyone can help me? I have an acquaintance who is High Church of England. She accepts most things that Orthodoxy teaches and has a lot of sympathy with the Orthodox Church. One thing she cannot accept is the veneration of the relics of the saints. She very recently pointed out that Cardinal Newman is to be beatified and canonised, in readiness for which they have, in her words, 'dug him up, put new vestements on him, chopped off some of his fingers to be sent to Rome as relics, and then buried him again. [I don't know about this but it doesn't matter.] This seems to me ghoulish and unnecessary'. How might we persuasively explain the Orthodox tradition regarding relics to such a person? In so doing, would it be wrong to relate those experiences of the grace and fragrance from relics which I'm sure we all have had?

[Eric Peterson]

I guess, Andreas, for my part, I would speak more about historical proofs of the veneration of relics, then speak of miracles of healing. I'd avoid smells. Maybe I'd mention the myrrh-streaming St. Demetrius.

It'd be good to get some stories of veneration of relics in old Orthodox England. This would prove, perhaps, that it is a thing which is very old and not connected to morbidity or superstition.

[Herman Blaydoe]

When a person becomes sanctified, it is not simply the "spirit" or "soul" that becomes holy. We are trinitarian creatures (body soul and spirit) created in the image and likeness of our Creator, the Trinity. Our bodies are part of who and what we are, what affects the spirit also affects the body.

Therefore the bodies of the saints partake of the holiness of that saint, theosis touches every hair on the head. The early church worshipped on the tombs of the martyrs, this is why we have relics of the saints in our altars. Grace rests in the bodies of the saints. We honor that grace. The body of saint is not a discarded shell, it merely awaits the Transfiguration at the end of times. Dem bones, dem bones, dem dry bones, will once again testify to the Glory of God (Ezekiel 37:1-14).

Herman the not-so-boney Pooh

[Andreas Moran]

Thank you Eric and Herman. Any more offers?

[Paul Cowan]

For the same reason she has kept the quilt her great grandmother knitted 100+ years ago or the Bible her father had growing up. There is a connection to the person through the object. We just hold the relics in much more esteem than the quilt. They both remind us of the life of the person and what they stood for. The relics are embued with Holyness whereas the quilt; mothballs. (That was meant as a positive statement)

Paul

[Andrew]

Sometimes the "strange" is effective... like how Saint Demetrios literally drenches the floor with myrrh, how barren old couples have a child from the oil at St. Anne's Skete (and there are the pictures there to prove it!), the miraculous healings from cancer and other ailments, fragrance, etc. Also, Saint Augustine talks about the finding of relics in City of God multiple places, if memory serves me right, and most Anglicans have a favorable impression of him.

[Michael C.]

I wonder if anyone can help me? I have an acquaintance who is High Church of England. She accepts most things that Orthodoxy teaches and has a lot of sympathy with the Orthodox Church. One thing she cannot accept is the veneration of the relics of the saints. She very recently pointed out that Cardinal Newman is to be beatified and canonised, in readiness for which they have, in her words, 'dug him up, put new vestements on him, chopped off some of his fingers to be sent to Rome as relics, and then buried him again. [I don't know about this but it doesn't matter.] This seems to me ghoulish and unnecessary'. How might we persuasively explain the Orthodox tradition regarding relics to such a person? In so doing, would it be wrong to relate those experiences of the grace and fragrance from relics which I'm sure we all have had?

Hi Andreas!

I found this when I did a search for relics on an Orthodox English web site. Hope it helps:

http://www.orthodoxengland.org.uk/athpatro.htm

[Ryan]

If someone volunteers to be an organ donor, when they die, parts of their body are used to help others live. I don't think that's ghoulish or unnecessary. I think it is similar with saints' relics.