Fasting for beginners: How and why?

[Keith Cheesman]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

[Herman Blaydoe]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

First off, make sure you have realistic expectations. Don't expect to feel "holy" or see angels simply because you haven't eaten, and if you do see "angels" make sure you eat something, it could just be low blood sugar...

Fasting within Orthodoxy is more than not eating. When we fast, we do so in obedience. We also try to fast from sin, in that we make an extra effort to stay away from activities besides eating that lead to sin. One helpful addition that I have been taught is that the extra money you are not spending on food should be given out as extra alms/charity. The time you don't spend eating should be spent in extra prayer and spiritual reading.

But beyond that, fasting should be viewed as part of a spiritual exercise regime, which we generally call "asceticism". It is best done under the direction of a "coach" or spiritual advisor who understands the true purpose and proper methods of fasting, which is hard to come by outside the Orthodox Church. Like with any exercise regime, you start slow and build up as circumstance and ability allow. You do not walk into a gym and start to bench press 400 lbs, nor try to run an entire marathon on the first day.

And if all you feel is tired and hungry, remember to think of those who are tired and hungry all the time because they are poor and are so involuntarily. Like any other exercise, results should not be expected immediately, but slowly over time, and the more effort you put into it, the more progress you will see. However you need to be careful not to try and do too much too quickly, that way often leads to disappointment and discouragement.

In Orthodoxy, we have another advantage in that our fasting is pretty well structured. We have appointed times and ways to fast and we do it regularly and often, so as to get used to it quickly.

Try fasting on Wednesdays and Fridays. The Wednesday fast is in remembrance of the betrayal of Christ by Judas. Pray that you not emulate his example! The Friday fast remembers the Crucifixion, the Sacrifice made on our behalf. Think about Christ saying "I thirst!" and perhaps your pangs will not seem quite so great in comparison.

We have basically two kinds of fasts, selective abstention and total abstention. We abstain from all food and drink prior to receiving Holy Communion from the time we go to sleep at night (or at least from midnight on if you like to stay up very late) until the next day after receiving.

For Wednesdays and Fridays, we abstain from meat and dairy, basically all animal products and also from oils. There is actually more to it than that, depending on the season and modifications for specific feasts, but I hope you get the general idea.

We also have the Great Fast of Great and Holy Lent, Holy Week (just prior to Pascha/Easter), the Apostle's Fast in June, the Dormition Fast in August, strict fasts for the remembrance of the beheading of the Baptist (also in August), the day prior to Theophany/Baptism of Christ, the Elevation of the Holy Cross in September, and the Nativity Fast before the Nativity/Christmas. An acquaintance once counted them all up and said that there are actually only about 100 days out of the year that we don't fast! Interestingly enough, there are also times when we are not allowed to fast at all, like the week after Pascha/Easter and Nativity/Christmas and I believe the week after Pentecost.

Why? Because exercise is good for you. If you do not exercise your body it becomes flabby and unhealthy and suseptible to sickness. If you do not exercise spiritually, you become spiritually "flabby", unhealthy and even more suseptable to sin. Fasting is telling your body that it does not control you, that you are more than an animal responding to its appetite, that there are more important things in your life, like Christ! Even Christ fasted! If we want to be like Him we should try to do as He did in as much as we are able.

If you were Orthodox, I would say talk with your priest or spiritual advisor. Beyond that I might recommend a couple of Orthodox books on the subject if you are truely interested, such as The Way of the Ascetics by Tito Colliander, and Making Christ Real in the Orthodox Christian Home by Anthony M. Coniaris.

FWIW,
Herman

[Father David Moser]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

I know that you wanted "experiences", however experience out of context is worthless, therefore to really understand why and how we fast some "theory" is a good thing. The first and most basic rule of fasting is that it is done in obedience to the tradition of the Church, that is according to the rhythm and pattern established by the Church for our spiritual health. To apply that general tradition to the particular circumstance of each person, we are given our priests who by instruction or confession or through spiritual advice teach us how we should work out the fast in our own lives. Obedience such as this is extremely important in fasting for it is in the "cutting off of the will" and "self denial" that any ascetic effort (of which fasting is the most common manifestation) has its true impact.

Therefore in order to understand the theory and practice of fasting in the Orthodox Church I offer this webpage (http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/pr_fasting.aspx) which is dedicated entirely to articles about fasting, both from the fathers and from more recent spiritual writers. I would suggest that while reading all of these articles are good - do not try to put them into practice without consulting a spiritual guide/director/father who can advise and direct you in your ascetic labor. From this page I particularly like this article by Metropolitan Philaret (http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/prayer_feasts_fasts.aspx) of blessed memory because it speaks of fasting within the context of prayer and the fasting/feasting rhythm of the Church.

Fr David Moser

[Vasiliki D.]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

Hi, I just wanted to point out that Herman and Father David Moser's posts were really really good and accurate and you should really take both of their advise on the matter of fasting.

I just wanted to share with you that when I was little it was the hardest to fast. I have been fasting from the age of 4. I observed the fasting every Wednesday and Friday I also kept a fast on Saturday's if I wanted to Commune and I also held the big fasts too. I fasted 50 days for Easter, 40 days for Christmas - fasted for the Virgin mary and also fasted for the Apostles plus observed the fasts for Christ and St. John the Baptist as appointed by the Church ... like I said, from the age of 4. It was hard for me as a child because my birthday falls on the 8th of August which is in the middle of a fast for the Virgin. As a kid, I never had a birthday cake because i loved Panagia more than I loved myself ... but it was still hard because I was always a little less social than the kids (and back in those days, we didnt have much of the soy fasting alternatives that we have today) but God compensated always ... I missed out on birthday parties he rewarded this little social orphan with other gifts that children dont naturally have! Anway, moving along.

When I turned 20, I was diagnosed with Diabetis mellitus ... to this day I continue my fasting. To be sure, my spiritual father has advised me that if I ever feel weak due to my illness only then am I granted some concession but it is the exception and not the rule. Guess what?

If a kid can do it .. so can an adult and if an Insulin dependant adult can do it ... so can an adult.

Dont be scared - fear is of the devil.

The Church is wise and knows everything in its wisdom.

Take a leap of faith into the fasting and you will be OK and God compensates us all for our effort - all that is required is EFFORT the rest falls in place! Remember guidance by Spiritual father is very important. God Bless. We will ALL say a prayer for you to help you along in your struggle :)

[Nina]

From St. John of Kronstadt (My Life in Christ; Holy Trinity Monastery pg. 318):


"It is necessary for a Christian to fast, in order to clear his mind, to rouse and develop his feelings, and to stimulate his will to useful activity. These three human capabilities we darken and stifle above all by 'surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life' (Lk. 21:34)."

[Paul Cowan]

If a kid can do it .. so can an adult and if an Insulin dependant adult can do it ... so can an adult.

:)

Not in all cases. My wife is Type 1 diabetic and cannot fast. (from foods) she also though has several other medical complications.

What the others have said above is good advise. If you would like some BAD personal experiences...

I tried without understanding or supervision a 7 days strict fast. I succeeded living on liquids only. I also gave myself disentary and was sick for days afterwards. We are not called to be supermen from the outset. We start slow like anythign else we do and grow into it. Don't attempt anything without a guide that has successfully done it before. If you are not Orthodox, this is a great time to look into it. We just ended a major Fast and are about 6 weeks from starting the next one.

I heard someone say one time if you count all the fasting days and prepatory fasting days we end up with 41 days in the year to "let loose". Not that our bodies could handle letting loose after all the other restrictive times. Just as well I suppose

[Vasiliki D.]

Not in all cases. My wife is Type 1 diabetic and cannot fast. (from foods) she also though has several other medical complications.

What the others have said above is good advise. If you would like some BAD personal experiences...

I tried without understanding or supervision a 7 days strict fast. I succeeded living on liquids only. I also gave myself disentary and was sick for days afterwards. We are not called to be supermen from the outset. We start slow like anythign else we do and grow into it. Don't attempt anything without a guide that has successfully done it before. If you are not Orthodox, this is a great time to look into it. We just ended a major Fast and are about 6 weeks from starting the next one.

I heard someone say one time if you count all the fasting days and prepatory fasting days we end up with 41 days in the year to "let loose". Not that our bodies could handle letting loose after all the other restrictive times. Just as well I suppose

I am also a Type 1 diabetic. I survice on regular 'shoot ups' throughout my day and have the constant yo-yo effects of high or low sugar levels ... the other thing that we diabetics on insulin have to deal with is the biological affect the medication has on our actual personalities ... it changes our whole "who we are" subtly ... then, on top of the biological, there is the emotional and social and pshycological affects this life condition places on us. However, at the start (when i first was diagnosed) I was absolutely allowed to discontinue my fasting ... but with time, we had to weave it back into my lifestyle and I have found that now ... my sugar levels are more under-control the days that I fast than the days I dont ...

I think it all depends on what type of Insulin you are on too ... I am finally on a type that controls my sugars in a stable line .. whereas before the release of insulin into my bloodstream was the shape of a bell ...so, i could never predict the timing of my quick release insuling and what my eating would do to my sugars.

However, I now fast again the way I used to before i was diagnosed. the only difference is ...if my sugars are low .. I eat the jelly beans, wait and then have a slice of bread to stabilise the situation!

Your wife must follow what HER spiritual father has directed her and not what I am saying .. I am sharing! and PS ... my previous post was supposed to give some encouragement not kill-joy :-) Hehehe

[Fyodor Vaskovsky]

Yes, And that is the question. First, you have to ask yourself this question. What for are you fasting?

Second, your specific situation could be better addressed by your spiritual father, or just a priest who knows you enough and whom you trust.

You see, demons are the best fasters - they never eat! Orthodox fast is something different from a diet and it is not the ultimate goal of Christian life. Merely abstaining from food will get you nowhere...

[Anthony A.]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

Keith, when I was not in the Orthodox Church, more of a nondenominational minister and follower of Christ, I found a great 1st century writing of the early Church at the time of the apostles called didache, Teachings of the Apostles. At the time, I was amazed that Christians fasted every Wednesday and Friday from the beginning. So, I started fasting every Wednesday and Friday. My spiritual experience has been that many sins that held on to me very strongly for many years weakened dramatically and with readings of more early Christian writings of the first 1000 years of faithful pastors and Christian leaders, I was able to experience greater strength to say No to sins. It is amazing how by concentrating on obeying Christ more strictly than "normal" on fast days, after saying no to sins on those days, it became easier to say no to sins on other days.

I shared on another post, that hearing the CEO of Thomas Nelson publishers speak about the Orthodox fast on http://ancientfaith.com/podcasts/eastwest/P7/ helped me understand that fasting should be like exercise, where one builds up a greater capacity as years go by, and of course, only by The Grace of our LORD Jesus Christ.

I had lots of questions at first on how the early Christians fasted. Not 100% sure, but the best that I have found so far, is that abstaining from meats and eating vegetables, rice, beans, and no dairies, has been normal practice of the Church for many years now. There are times when one does fast more strictly like before Holy Communion, with no water or food for at least 4 hours or from midnight, but don't get caught up in any legalism of it, since as one priest shared, fasting alone cannot save anyone, but we are saved by the Grace given to us by The Holy Spirit through various ways as determined by our Sovereign God. One good practice is to start eating less during your meals on Wednesday and Friday and find a worthy cause to give of yourself specially during those days and concentrate on fasting from more sins for those 24 hour period. After a few months, write down any changes. The Sovereign Grace of The Holy Spirit is absolutely needed to fast in The Spirit of Grace of our LORD Jesus Christ, so during your fasting, find out more about the historical faith of the early Orthodox Church.

Curious brother Keith, what is drawing you to look at fasting and specially Orthodoxy?

[Keith Cheesman]

Curious brother Keith, what is drawing you to look at fasting and specially Orthodoxy?

Why am I looking at Orthodoxy? I don't know, I just seem to be fascinated with it at the moment, maybe it's some strange whim, maybe it's a calling from God. I guess I'll find out in time.

I am interested in fasting because it is an important part of being Orthodox. I want to experience Orthodoxy as well as find out about it intellectually. Even if I do not convert, I hope to at least learn a few things that will enrich my walk with God.

[M.C. Steenberg]

Dear Kieth and others,

At the heart of fasting is love. Love of God, love of neighbour, love of creation -- and the desire for a more genuine love of self: not the egoistic self-love of our sinful existence, but the authentic awareness of every creature of God's, including ourselves, as precious and capable of redemption and participation in His glory.

Others have, above, given very helpful and useful comments on the nature of fasting, obedience to fasting rules, the reality of Orthodox fasting as part-and-parcel of the whole Orthodox life of ascesis, obedience and repentance. I would add to this only a general comment: every approach to fasting must begin with the conscious awareness of love, and the need to exercise a truer, freer, more genuine love. When we see fasting from the perspective of a love seeking renewal and purification in Christ, we see all the acts and actions of fasting as tools towards this end. Our love is worldly; let us strip away some of its worldly connections. Our love is too often not really love but simply satiety, satisfaction; let us live for a time without being sated or satisfied. Our love is too often the fruit of laziness and accidie; let us set our hearts to work, to struggle for a bit. Our love of God is too often almost accidental to the 'rest of our life'; let us, for a time, deliberately cast off the normal shackles of our day-to-day existence, and find a love of God that becomes the very centre of our being.

All the tools of the fast -- diet, alms, modified prayer rules and services, etc. -- give us the means to a truer love.

INXC, Dcn Matthew

[Vasiliki D.]

Dear Kieth and others,

At the heart of fasting is love. Love of God, love of neighbour, love of creation -- and the desire for a more genuine love of self: not the egoistic self-love of our sinful existence, but the authentic awareness of every creature of God's, including ourselves, as precious and capable of redemption and participation in His glory.

Others have, above, given very helpful and useful comments on the nature of fasting, obedience to fasting rules, the reality of Orthodox fasting as part-and-parcel of the whole Orthodox life of ascesis, obedience and repentance. I would add to this only a general comment: every approach to fasting must begin with the conscious awareness of love, and the need to exercise a truer, freer, more genuine love. When we see fasting from the perspective of a love seeking renewal and purification in Christ, we see all the acts and actions of fasting as tools towards this end. Our love is worldly; let us strip away some of its worldly connections. Our love is too often not really love but simply satiety, satisfaction; let us live for a time without being sated or satisfied. Our love is too often the fruit of laziness and accidie; let us set our hearts to work, to struggle for a bit. Our love of God is too often almost accidental to the 'rest of our life'; let us, for a time, deliberately cast off the normal shackles of our day-to-day existence, and find a love of God that becomes the very centre of our being.

All the tools of the fast -- diet, alms, modified prayer rules and services, etc. -- give us the means to a truer love.

INXC, Dcn Matthew

Yes, beautifully captures words .. how many times do we hear this from the priest during his sermon but we try that is all we can do. Love is a fruit of the Holy Spirit so it is something we have to work hard for and if God is merciful to us He gives it in its increments ... may we ALL in this New Year be blessed to work UP the ladder of love ...

[Mary]

I do not currently fast. I have tried in the past once or twice and I am not sure I ended up with anything other than a day of being hungry. So I have two questions:

1. How would you recommend someone starting out to begin fasting?
2. How has fasting helped you?
3. How does partial (is that the right word?) fasting work?

I'm eager to hear about people's experiences rather than just "theoretical" answers.

Keith,

I think, it's important to have someone to talk to when you begin experimenting with Orthodox traditions. Not necessarily someone to tell you what to do, but someone to dialogue with about the things that you're testing and the things that you suddenly start becoming aware of. They may or may not be important things, but it's good to have someone to talk to.

I say this, mostly because, fasting makes me very much aware of all the things that I need to change in my life. It sort of prepares me for confession. And if I did not have confession, as an outlet, to help me get rid of all the stuff that surfaces during fasting, it will become too much to bear.

I was in communication with an orthodox friend when I began experimenting with fasting. And although my e-mails were not formal confessions, they were, brutally honest, and I think they helped me, in the same way that going to confession helps me now.

On a practical level, I don't know what kind of person you are. But I'm the kind that jumps into the deep end of the pool before learning how to swim. And then I swallow too much water and think I'm dying. But, who can tell a stubborn person what to do? I just have to learn the hard way. I'm back to the beginning now, building up my strength to fast, instead of doing as much as I can, as fast as I can. But, I think, in the end, it doesn't really matter, because God takes whatever we have to offer Him, and uses it to heal us. After all, I doubt if I'll ever get to the place where I'll be able to offer up a perfect fast or a perfect prayer or a perfect confession. In fact, i wonder sometimes, if my worst offerings are actually the best, because I know they're bad, and I ask for forgiveness for offering up such pathetic sacrifices.

I dunno. It's best to start things simple. If you've never fasted before, you could start with Wednesdays and Fridays, and cut out just meat and then dairy. Guess it depends on how you already eat. There are people out there who are vegan and since our strict fast days are vegan, if a person is already vegan, I wouldn't have a clue how they should fast! Perhaps they could cut out fancy deserts... =) So, there's the very general guidelines of how to fast, and those are all fine tuned by the priest, to fit individuals.

And what fasting has done for me, personally, it has indeed helped to weaken the hold of habitual sins in my life. And it has also helped me become very much aware of my 'unknown' sins - those that I just commit automatically, without thought - things like passing judgement on others or myself. It's kind of confusing in a way. While some sins are weakening, I seem to be more full of sin than ever before, because of my awareness of more things. That's why confession is so important. Can't carry around all that sin.

In Christ,
Mary.

[Fr Raphael Vereshack]

This past year someone gave me the most interesting Orthodox wall calendar from Russia.

As most of you who are Orthodox probably already know- and which Keith may be interested to find out- all Orthodox wall calendars indicate the fasting rule for each day.

This particular calendar from Russia though had two pages for each month. One page was the fasting rule day by day 'by the typikon' while the other facing page was a fasting rule for beginners.

This seems like a wonderful idea especially for those just learning to fast, or the sick, elderly, etc.

In Christ- Fr Raphael

[Anthony A.]

Why am I looking at Orthodoxy? I don't know, I just seem to be fascinated with it at the moment, maybe it's some strange whim, maybe it's a calling from God. I guess I'll find out in time.

I am interested in fasting because it is an important part of being Orthodox. I want to experience Orthodoxy as well as find out about it intellectually. Even if I do not convert, I hope to at least learn a few things that will enrich my walk with God.

Thanks for sharing Keith. May your journey and growth in Christ always be filled with The Holy Spirit's supernatural transformation into the image and perfections of God.

humbly in Christ,
Anthony

[Anthony A.]

Steenberg, Very moving words. Wonderful and encouraging to hear such beautiful words on our focus on experiencing God's Love above and in the midst of our journey through fasting. Thanks.

Wondering if you found quotes like these from any specific Church Father or just an amalgamation of readings transforming you personally?


Dear Kieth and others,

At the heart of fasting is love. Love of God, love of neighbour, love of creation -- and the desire for a more genuine love of self: not the egoistic self-love of our sinful existence, but the authentic awareness of every creature of God's, including ourselves, as precious and capable of redemption and participation in His glory.

Others have, above, given very helpful and useful comments on the nature of fasting, obedience to fasting rules, the reality of Orthodox fasting as part-and-parcel of the whole Orthodox life of ascesis, obedience and repentance. I would add to this only a general comment: every approach to fasting must begin with the conscious awareness of love, and the need to exercise a truer, freer, more genuine love. When we see fasting from the perspective of a love seeking renewal and purification in Christ, we see all the acts and actions of fasting as tools towards this end. Our love is worldly; let us strip away some of its worldly connections. Our love is too often not really love but simply satiety, satisfaction; let us live for a time without being sated or satisfied. Our love is too often the fruit of laziness and accidie; let us set our hearts to work, to struggle for a bit. Our love of God is too often almost accidental to the 'rest of our life'; let us, for a time, deliberately cast off the normal shackles of our day-to-day existence, and find a love of God that becomes the very centre of our being.

All the tools of the fast -- diet, alms, modified prayer rules and services, etc. -- give us the means to a truer love.

INXC, Dcn Matthew

[Keith Cheesman]

Thanks for the helpful posts everybody. I think I will try fasting on Wednesdays and Fridays as suggested. First just cutting out meat and then in time dairy products and oil.

I am interested in finding out more about the kind of things people do alongside the food part of fasting. Using the money saved to give alms and the time saved for extra prayer/reading etc. What kinds of things would you suggest to do?

[Paul Cowan]

What kinds of things would you suggest to do?

First I would say STOP. Go find a priest, connect with him as your spiritual advisor and do what he says. I highly encourage you to NOT do anything ascetical from reading this or any other forum. Do not put your self will before God's. To do so will only hurt you physically, spiritually and emotionally as well as those around you.

If you are not willing to be under authority of a spiritual father who you can see and talk to then how can you be under the authority of God who you can't see or talk to?

Don't do this thing you are thinking.

from someone who tried it on his own,
Paul

[Vasiliki D.]

Keith, I will also suggest that you do the following:

Find yourself a Spiritual Father.

There is no greater ALMS (act of charity) than to submit your will into the Will of God for the Bible says, that we must love our neighbours as we love ourselves - how can anyone love their neighbour if they have not learnt to love themselves first! The ultimate act of love to your own self is to sacrifice your self to God and everyone in the Orthodox church who knows this knows that this sacrifice occurs each time we consult our Spiritual Father and we burn our sins as incense before God and we in humility do whatever our Spiritual Father asks of us ...

God Bless you and show you His Mercy! :-)

[Anthony A.]

Keith, God is Sovereign and The Holy Spirit is Stronger and Greater than all of our understanding. You are just starting out on your journey and experience in Christ similar to what Christians have done for 2000 years. From firsthand experience, I can say that a priest is a godly man that can provide guidance but he is also fallible and can sometimes push some away due to misunderstanding of your struggles and lack of understanding of your frame of reference due to his current personal growth. Having said that, a person with experience and understanding of The Holy Spirit's guidance and power within the Orthodox Church of Christ can provide additional guidance to avoid some unnecessary struggles, but God is Sovereign either way.

My humble understanding is that God is ALL POWERFUL and Gracious to guide our hearts with or without a priest as he has many Saints in our Orthodox Faith in the past and continues to do so among many of us who begin as seekers. Continue your journey into the practice of 1st century Christian fasting and prayerfully study the writings of the early Church. Consider understanding the meaning behind an Orthodox Liturgy that has been developed for 2000 years with most of it being very similar to the early church. Once you understand some parts of why we have our liturgy focused so much on Worshiping Christ our God and joining with the hosts in heaven, it would be wonderful if you have an Orthodox Church nearby that has Worship Services in English so you can also experience Worship within the context of The Church.

Thank God for diversity of opinions on nondogma issues of The Holy Orthodox Catholic Church.


First I would say STOP. Go find a priest, connect with him as your spiritual advisor and do what he says. I highly encourage you to NOT do anything ascetical from reading this or any other forum. Do not put your self will before God's. To do so will only hurt you physically, spiritually and emotionally as well as those around you.

If you are not willing to be under authority of a spiritual father who you can see and talk to then how can you be under the authority of God who you can't see or talk to?

Don't do this thing you are thinking.

from someone who tried it on his own,
Paul

[Paul Cowan]

I suppose I lean on the side of conservatism and caution.


Acts 8:29 Then the Spirit said to Philip, “Go near and overtake this chariot.”
30 So Philip ran to him, and heard him reading the prophet Isaiah, and said, “Do you understand what you are reading?”
31 And he said, “How can I, unless someone guides me?” And he asked Philip to come up and sit with him.

We don't need to play "bubba in the basement" with the Faith and our lack of understanding of it. (mine included). There is virtually no medium to larger city in the country without an ordained priest of some jurisdiction. They all speak English, probably with an accent, or they would not have set up shop in America. Use this site (http://orthodoxyinamerica.org/lr_v10/locator.php)to find a canonicle church in your area.

The only thing worse than the blind leading the blind as Christ spoke in the parable, is the blind leading himself.

[Keith Cheesman]

I realize that ideally I should have a spiritual father, there is certainly no refusal or rebellion on my part. I just don't think at this stage I can form such a relationship as I have only just started learning about Orthodoxy. If further down the road I decide to convert then I think it would be different.

Remember we Protestants are quite used to "doing it for ourselves". Caution is the order of the day, but I don't see the harm in a gentle introduction to fasting?

[Paul Cowan]

I too was Protestant for 32 years before I became Orthodox. And I still am cautious after 8 years of Orthodoxy.

What I liken your appeal to is driving. Given a set of car keys you could probably figure out how to stick them in the ignition, shift into drive and press on the pedals until one moved you forward. Use the steering wheel and press the other pedal until you brake.

OR

Go to a driving education course, learn about the blinkers, windshield washers, how to change a tire, how to use a stick shift (those cars have 3 pedals BTW) and the need to get a license. Working out our salvation alone or without guidance only makes a person more confused, desperate and lost. Especially more prone to give up if you don't know the how's and why's of what you think you should be doing.

It's a very difficult thing to pick up that phone for the first time or to knock on the priest's office door. I'm in sales, trust me I know. But I have never been thrown out of a client's office. You may find that car from the example above is a Toyota Prius and does not even have a key. (My mom just got one, and I just sat there looking at it trying to figure out how to start the silly thing until she showed me) There is nothing wrong with doing it on your own up to a point (I suppose). But how will you know what that "point" is?

[M.C. Steenberg]

Dear Kieth,

There is obvious sincerity of intent in your questions - may God bless it.

Without wanting to offer any kind of personal 'advice' or guidance (this is something which can never really be given in a healthy way over the generic venue of the public internet; it requires true pastoral engagement - with one making that contact with a person to assist and teach), it is worth noting as a general comment that a beginning of fasting comes in reassessing the way we love. If one finds he has the urge, the desire to fast when he has never done so before, this is the stirring of God in the heart for a new degree and type of love -- and so the initial response must be to explore how. How is my love weak, and how is this calling aimed to convert my love? And then, how can I use the practical steps of basic fasting -- giving up certain things, whilst increasing charitable activity -- to explore my own hindered love, and its transformation?

Such steps put things in the right context. From there, one must take the step to seek pastoral guidance -- for we are easily confused and mislead by our own understandings (especially of ourself). But surely a beginning can come in the meager tasks of altering one's diet and giving almst, so long as these are done in the conscious exercise of a self-sacrifical love that seeks its renewal and purification.

INXC, Dcn Matthew

[Anthony A.]

Guidance by Scripture and Original Understanding of our Apostles as taught by The Holy Spirit and Christ Himself is definitely the most powerful place of understanding as our brother in Christ from Ethiopia understood. Thankfully, The Scripture does not say that from then on, Phillip hung around with the Ethiopian as his spiritual father for many years guiding him even on the smaller areas of life and allowing him to make no decisions on his own unless guided by a father. Rather, Phillip was miraculously translated to another city immediately.

God has graciously given the saints the blessings of God Gifted Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists and Pastors and Teachers for the building up of the faith of the saints. Thankfully, He sovereignly and supernaturally guides us all by The Living Grace and holds us individually accountable for our actions and not give our responsibilities to another since at the Great Judgment each one of us must account for ourselves and no teacher or "father" can be a scapegoat when they might lead us wrong. Bless those amongst us who lead wisely and guide us in The Spirit as they serve God faithfully as our priests and Bishops and theologians, but we must also be careful that no one trick us to think we have to have a man's guidance and call on "humility" as submission to man, rather than submission to God (It is better for us to Obey God rather than man (Acts 5). Even little children are bidded to come to The LORD directly by faith as a child, even if our Holy Apostles tried to hold them back.

Remember God sovereignly leading a Roman soldier and leader in visions without a man, how much more can he do so today: "At Caesarea there was a man named Cornelius, a centurion in what was known as the Italian Regiment. He and all his family were devout and God-fearing; he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly. One day at about three in the afternoon he had a vision. He distinctly saw an angel of God, who came to him and said, Cornelius! Cornelius stared at him in fear. "What is it, Lord?" he asked. The angel answered, "Your prayers and gifts to the poor have come up as a memorial offering before God." You see how God is not just a "conservative" but "generous" with the Grace of His Spirit to all, with and without a fallible priest or pope.

That's why I encourage all to be faithful with the Light you have been given , and to he who has been faithful with little, much greater rewards are given as his eyes might be opened to the blessing God gave the Orthodox Church of the 1st century by leading them to fast and pray on Wednesdays and Friday. May God guide you into all Truth as He has so many of us to His ancient and holy ONE Faith, ONE LORD and ONE Baptism.

humbly in Christ,
Anthony

I suppose I lean on the side of conservatism and caution.



We don't need to play "bubba in the basement" with the Faith and our lack of understanding of it. (mine included). There is virtually no medium to larger city in the country without an ordained priest of some jurisdiction. They all speak English, probably with an accent, or they would not have set up shop in America. Use this site (http://orthodoxyinamerica.org/lr_v10/locator.php)to find a canonicle church in your area.

The only thing worse than the blind leading the blind as Christ spoke in the parable, is the blind leading himself.

[Anna Stickles]

Dear Anthony and Paul,

I think a good thought to keep in mind is balance in all things and not to go to extremes.

Anthony bringing up the example of Cornelius is a wonderfully relevant example here. Long before the vision God was stirring the heart of this centurion and he responded in love…In love to God and his fellow man within the context of the religious traditions of his day. For many years he was faithful to what he knew. His faithfulness brought God’s attention and God sent him a vision to lead him to a more perfect Way. God in that vision did not lead him to continue to serve on his own. No. God brought the centurion at that point into contact with Christ in the person of Peter. He brought him into contact with Christ in his Church. The centurian was to send for Peter who then came and preached the message. The centurion received the Holy Spirit in the presence of Peter, witnessed by Peter, and Peter baptized him. Thus it was through human hands that the centaurian was united with Christ. Even Paul did not become a lone ranger Christian. He was healed and baptized by Ananias and later He submitted his teaching to those in Jerusalem, lest he had run his race in vain.

There is a time for everything and everything in its time. Much of our search for God is done on our own. God certainly is helping us and leading us to Himself all the time – through circumstances, through people we meet, through the inner promptings of our heart, but there eventually comes a time when we start to recognize the truth of God Incarnate, God in his Church, God in His living and very human Body, and then the challenge comes to move from merely communing with God under the forms of barren tradition or individual impulse to communing with God as part of something more real, immediate and living. However, the passage into this real and living communion must involve submission to that real and living Body as we find it.

This kind of submission is far from some robotic existence in which we give up our individual personality or decision making. It is far from abdicating responsibility for ourself. Proper submission is rather the effort to take up responsibility for being in a proper relationship with our brothers rather then only being concerned with our own relationship to God. In this we move from thinking in terms of “my individual relationship with God” to recognizing that we are part of something much bigger then ourself. It is accepting that
Eph 4:11-13,16 It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ...From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.

What kind of schism would have happened from the very beginning if Paul with his gifts and calling had not submitted himself, and all the churches under him, to Peter and the others in Jerusalem? Where would Cornelius have been if he had said, “ I don’t need this Peter guy, God can continue to guide me on my own." He may have continued in an individual relationship with God but would he have been part of the larger communion of the Church?

[Norman Barber]

this is all very interesting! i would like to know in simple terms what to eat and not to eat on fast days.
thank you for a reply in advance

[D. W. Dickens]

The longer I'm online the more firmly I'm coming to conclude that fasting is something best done and almost never talked about. It seems a favorite subject online and a strangely absent thing off-line. I'm not complaining about the topic on the board, it was a reasonable question and there were excellent answers. But after seeing a pot roast or two at a monastery during Lent, the subject begins to lose a bit of it's gravitas.

[Father David Moser]

this is all very interesting! i would like to know in simple terms what to eat and not to eat on fast days.
thank you for a reply in advance

There is a strict rule of fasting in which we abstain from all meat, dairy, fish, wine and oil on fast days. Sometimes, due to the importance of a feast, the fast is relaxed from that strict rule. This is the clear instruction of the typicon. BUT ... The fasting rule, like all the other rules of the Church, must be applied to each person in a way that is beneficial to their spiritual health. It can be (and often is) relaxed in parish settings - or it can be strengthened and made more strict in some cases. So the only real answer to this question is to do as your parish priest instructs you to do.

Fr David Moser

[Herman Blaydoe]

Unfortunately, the terms simply are not that simple, you need to check with your priest who gets his guidance from the Bishop. This is sort of like asking "how much should I exercise?" But in general it depends on which fast, whether or not there is a "feast" being celebrated on a "fast" day. Sometimes fish is allowed (like today) sometimes it isn't. A good church calendar usually goes a long way in providing this information. You can also check the Greek Orthodox website calendar here (http://www.goarch.org/chapel/calendar).

[Mark Harris]

On All Saints Day our priest in Moldova Romania advised on the full fast with the exception days for wine and oil and for fish. The understanding also is that fasting also apples to personal relations and to any excess (e.g. discos, parties etc) - this is of course hard for newly wed like me !!!