View Full Version : Holy Friday Matins (12 Gospels) and Holy Saturday Matins (Lamentations): Texts
Ioannis Fortomas
12-04-2009, 07:02 AM
Dear All,
Where could I find the text in English for Holy Friday's Matins, the 12 Gospels, and Holy Saturday's Matins, the Lamentations? If possible, where could I also find the Royal Hours and Great Vespers for Holy Friday? I've looked in a lot of places online and I can't seem to come up with anything.
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
May you have a blessed Holy Week and Pascha!
Rd. Ioannis
Fr Raphael Vereshack
12-04-2009, 03:24 PM
Dear All,
Where could I find the text in English for Holy Friday's Matins, the 12 Gospels, and Holy Saturday's Matins, the Lamentations? If possible, where could I also find the Royal Hours and Great Vespers for Holy Friday? I've looked in a lot of places online and I can't seem to come up with anything.
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
May you have a blessed Holy Week and Pascha!
Rd. Ioannis
All of these services are found in The Lenten Triodion published by Faber (lately by St Tikhon's Press I think) and translated by Mother Mary & Met. Kallistos Ware. There a quite a few copies available at a very decent price from Abebooks and probably from Amazon.
I doubt these services can be found online.
In Christ- Fr Raphael
Ioannis Fortomas
12-04-2009, 08:16 PM
I have the Lenten Triodion Father, but my parish would like to make little booklets - all in English for these services - so people can follow along, as the services are done mostly in Greek. I know its a kinda "last minute" thing to do. I've managed to find the Matins text from Monday - Thursday though.
Rd. Ioannis
Father David Moser
12-04-2009, 09:19 PM
I have the Lenten Triodion Father, but my parish would like to make little booklets - all in English for these services - so people can follow along, as the services are done mostly in Greek. I know its a kinda "last minute" thing to do. I've managed to find the Matins text from Monday - Thursday though.
Rd. Ioannis
IIRC, St Vladimir's Seminary Press has a whole series of booklets for every day of Holy Week. If you get these you don't have to do the typing...
Fr David Moser
I doubt these services can be found online.
I'm glad to say that these services are indeed available online, Father. Here is a good source:
http://www.anastasis.org.uk/holyweek.htm
(The English used is generally quite good, though the odd quirk like "humankind" is a little jarring.)
In book form, the most useful is "Holy Week and Easter", compiled by Fr George Papadeas, which has been in print for over 30 years, and is readily available in English-speaking countries. It contains the entire text of every service from Palm Sunday evening, to the Agape Vespers on the evening of Easter day, in Greek and corresponding English translation. It is also an easier book to handle compared to the Lenten Triodion, and it is more comprehensive. The publisher is Patmos Press, South Daytona, Florida.
Compiling booklets for parish use involves not only using the specific texts for the given service, but also the "standard" portions of the basic service, such as litanies, psalm readings, prayers, etc. Having done this myself numerous times for many feasts and holy days over the years, I can tell you that it takes much effort and familiarity with the structure of services to get it right. For Holy Week and Easter, I would thoroughly recommend Fr George's book. It's all there.
Regarding liturgical materials from Slavic sources such as St Vladimir's, it should be remembered that there are small but significant differences between Greek and Russian texts. For instance, the Lamentations are sung at a different point in the service depending on Greek or Russian usage; Russian usage calls for the singing of short psalm verses between each stanza of lamentation, whereas the Greek omits these.
Anthony Stokes
13-04-2009, 04:58 AM
I would thoroughly recommend Fr George's book. It's all there.
Actually, that book is missing the Matins of Holy Thursday because the Greeks usually replace it with unction, which is not actually prescribed for Holy Week.
Sbdn. Anthony
Paul Cowan
13-04-2009, 05:01 AM
Actually, that book is missing the Matins of Holy Thursday because the Greeks usually replace it with unction, which is not actually prescribed for Holy Week.
Sbdn. Anthony
The Antiochians do Holy Unction on Wednesday night.
Actually, that book is missing the Matins of Holy Thursday because the Greeks usually replace it with unction, which is not actually prescribed for Holy Week.
Sbdn. Anthony
Sbdn Anthony, Ioannis is of the Greek tradition, so his church would almost certainly hold the Euchelaion service on Holy Wednesday evening, as set out in Fr George's book. :)
Father David Moser
13-04-2009, 06:35 AM
The Antiochians do Holy Unction on Wednesday night.
Yes, Holy Thursday matins is the service usually done on Holy Wednesday evening and thus would be the one eliminated. All the Holy Week services tend to be anticipated by at least half a day: Thus the evening "Bridegroom" services are really the Matins services of the next day, The Vesperal Liturgy for the Last Supper on Thursday morning is the Vespers of Thursday evening. Holy Friday Matins is the Crucifixion usually said on Thursday night and Holy Saturday Matins is the Burial, usually said on Friday night. Yes, it is a bit confusing, but then that's the way we do it.
Fr David Moser
Kosta
13-04-2009, 06:54 AM
I'm glad to say that these services are indeed available online, Father. Here is a good source:
http://www.anastasis.org.uk/holyweek.htm
(The English used is generally quite good, though the odd quirk like "humankind" is a little jarring.)
In book form, the most useful is "Holy Week and Easter", compiled by Fr George Papadeas, which has been in print for over 30 years, and is readily available in English-speaking countries. It contains the entire text of every service from Palm Sunday evening, to the Agape Vespers on the evening of Easter day, in Greek and corresponding English translation. It is also an easier book to handle compared to the Lenten Triodion, and it is more comprehensive. The publisher is Patmos Press, South Daytona, Florida.
Compiling booklets for parish use involves not only using the specific texts for the given service, but also the "standard" portions of the basic service, such as litanies, psalm readings, prayers, etc. Having done this myself numerous times for many feasts and holy days over the years, I can tell you that it takes much effort and familiarity with the structure of services to get it right. For Holy Week and Easter, I would thoroughly recommend Fr George's book. It's all there.
Regarding liturgical materials from Slavic sources such as St Vladimir's, it should be remembered that there are small but significant differences between Greek and Russian texts. For instance, the Lamentations are sung at a different point in the service depending on Greek or Russian usage; Russian usage calls for the singing of short psalm verses between each stanza of lamentation, whereas the Greek omits these.
The book by Fr George is available in every greek parish ive attended, displayed during holy week here in america. I use it myself and im surprised its not that common up in canada. A google search will easily show many places that have it for sale.
Andreas Moran
13-04-2009, 10:07 AM
Fr George Papadeas's book is widely used in England, and Fr Ephrem's site mentioned by Olga is incredibly comprehensive. A pity, though (for me and those similarly minded), that neither is in traditional liturgical English. Fr George's book curiously uses old language for the Our Father but not elsewhere. Whilst acknowledging Fr Ephrem's effort, his use of English rather grates with me. Are the SVS booklets for Holy Week equally comprehensive and what sort of language do they use?
Fr George Papadeas's book is widely used in England, and Fr Ephrem's site mentioned by Olga is incredibly comprehensive. A pity, though (for me and those similarly minded), that neither is in traditional liturgical English. Fr George's book curiously uses old language for the Our Father but not elsewhere. Whilst acknowledging Fr Ephrem's effort, his use of English rather grates with me. Are the SVS booklets for Holy Week equally comprehensive and what sort of language do they use?
There are two versions of Fr George's book, the 1996 edition, where the English is modern, but, in my opinion, quite formal and reverent; and the earlier, original edition (1976), which, from memory, used an older form of English. For those who prefer this form of language, it may be possible to find a second-hand copy of the earlier version.
Ioannis Fortomas
13-04-2009, 04:04 PM
Holy Unction is ment to be served before three of the Vesperal Liturgies of the year: Eve of Christmas, Eve of Theophany, and on Holy Thursday morning (transfered to Wednesday night to get a higher attendance). It's purpose mainly serves to prepare the faithful for the Holy Mysteries. Not that let's say, Holy Thursday's Holy Communion is more important then any other days, but because a lot of people will opt to Commune on Holy Thursday, having gone to Unction the night before saves the priest from having to hear 500 Confessions. Now, from what I know it doesn't of course replace Confession neither should one have the attitude of I'll go do this (name whatever sin) and then I'll go to Unction and I'll be just fine to Commune on Holy Thursday.
That being said, Holy Unction does not replace Matins of Holy Thursday (with it's beautiful Canon of the Mystical Supper). In my own parish, we do Holy Unction at 5pm, and then Matins follows immediatly, which in fact, is good, because during the singing of the Canon the Priest annoints people, whereas if we didn't do Matins he'd still be there for 45 min annointing people.
As for Fr. Pappadeas' book, it's good but we don't prefer his translation. And some services (such as the Hours and Vespers for the mornings), and the Matins of Holy Thursday arn't there. Also, we do a more fuller Lamantations on Holy Friday night, and he doesn't include all the Lamantations so this presents another problem.
Rd. Ioannis
Anthony Stokes
13-04-2009, 06:09 PM
There are two versions of Fr George's book, the 1996 edition, where the English is modern, but, in my opinion, quite formal and reverent; and the earlier, original edition (1976), which, from memory, used an older form of English. For those who prefer this form of language, it may be possible to find a second-hand copy of the earlier version.
Yes, luckily my version is the older one that does have more traditional language in it (plus all of my altar serving notes).
Sbdn. Anthony
Andreas Moran
13-04-2009, 10:44 PM
The full text of the Lamentations is available from Holy Transfiguration Monastery.
Nathaniel Woon
16-03-2011, 10:43 AM
I am just wondering - If short psalm verses between each stanza is the Slav tradition, when then does the HTM translation have them. Isn't HTM part of a non-canonical group that is in the Greek? I am a little confused...
Fr Raphael Vereshack
16-03-2011, 03:41 PM
I am just wondering - If short psalm verses between each stanza is the Slav tradition, when then does the HTM translation have them. Isn't HTM part of a non-canonical group that is in the Greek? I am a little confused...
Sorry- you need to clarify your question. Specifically what are you referring to.
In Christ- Fr Raphael
Father David Moser
16-03-2011, 04:03 PM
I am just wondering - If short psalm verses between each stanza is the Slav tradition,
In the matins of Great Saturday, the kathisma are read in a special manner - The appointed Kathisma from the Psalter is the 17th kathisma which consists solely of Ps 118. The troparia known as "the Praises" (or more often in modern practice the "Lamentations") are sung between the verses of Ps 118. This is universal practice (my reference here is the Lenten Triodion translated from the original Greek by Mother Mary and Archimandrite (now Archbishop) Kallistos Ware published by Faber and Faber). This edition is quite complete, listing many of the differences between Slav and Byzantine practice. There is no difference or variation noted for this particular rubric. I would suggest that if you are used to singing only the Lamentations without the Psalm verses then that is departure from tradition.
Fr David Moser
Anthony Stokes
16-03-2011, 04:40 PM
I believe the tradition is the same. But, you will also find that Slavic churches and Athonite style monasteries use a similar typikon. Many Greek Athonite monasteries use Russian style vestments, serve the vigil the Russian way, etc.
Sbdn. Anthony
I would suggest that if you are used to singing only the Lamentations without the Psalm verses then that is departure from tradition.I am not disputing the rubric, Father, but, in my experience of Greek parish practice, I have never come across the singing of the psalm verses between the Engomia. I have only encountered the singing of the psalm verses in Slavic churches.
Nathaniel Woon
17-03-2011, 02:51 PM
Dear Fr. Raphael,
I was referring to post #10 by Kosta "Regarding liturgical materials from Slavic sources such as St Vladimir's, it should be remembered that there are small but significant differences between Greek and Russian texts. For instance, the Lamentations are sung at a different point in the service depending on Greek or Russian usage; Russian usage calls for the singing of short psalm verses between each stanza of lamentation, whereas the Greek omits these."
HTM publications are as far as I know in the Greek tradition (though they were once part of ROCOR) hence my confusion. I noticed that the CD recording, Thy Passion: Byzantine Chant of Holy Week by Boston Byzantine Choir has the Psalm verses in between the troparia/Lamentations... this is if I am not mistaken an Antiochian effort but the Antiochian Holy Week and Pascha service book on the other hand has the Lamentations without the psalm verses... curioser and curioser!
Fr Raphael Vereshack
17-03-2011, 03:50 PM
Yes- in my HTM version of the Lamentations, the psalm verses are inserted between each tropar.
In Christ- Fr Raphael
Owen Jones
18-03-2011, 02:56 PM
It should be the 12 Gospel readings, not the 12 Gospels!
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