'Vainglory' of the Theotokos

[Ryan]

While reading Blessed Theophylact's commentary on St. Matthew's gospel, I came to 12: 47-50 (page 109 of the Chrysostom Press edition). This is where Christ's mother and brethren stand outside, trying to speak with him, and he says "...whosoever shall do the will of My Father Who is in heaven, the same is My brother, and sister, and mother."

Theophylact's comment is this: "He did not say this to offend his mother, but to correct this vainglorious and human thought of hers." I believe Bl. Theophylact is echoing Chrysostom here, whom he depends upon for much of his commentary.

Can we reconcile the understanding that the Theotokos is sinless, with this notion of her having a "vainglorious thought"?

[Paul Cowan]

The OSB does not use the word vainglorious, but uses the phrase "to correct thier thinking concerning Him". Why does Bl. Theophylact see their concern for Him as vainglory? The OSB also says He did not despise His mother by saying this, but tried to also help those sitting around Him understand who He was.


Luke 8:19 Then His mother and brothers came to Him, and could not approach Him because of the crowd. 20 And it was told Him by some, who said, “Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside, desiring to see You.”
21 But He answered and said to them, “My mother and My brothers are these who hear the word of God and do it.”


vain·glo·ri·ous (vn-glôr-s, -glr-)
adj.
1. Characterized by or exhibiting excessive vanity; boastful.
2. Proceeding from vainglory.


vainglorious - feeling self-importance; "too big for his britches"; "had a swelled head"; "he was swelled with pride"

I don't see this characteristic coming from the text.

Paul

[D. W. Dickens]

Can we reconcile the understanding that the Theotokos is sinless, with this notion of her having a "vainglorious thought"?

I'm not sure sinless is the best word. Since converting I've gone through my "Mary" struggles and come out the other side and never once stutter honoring her in Church or in my home. However, I've also seen plenty of Orthodox priest and theologians turning themselves into verbal knots trying to figure out a way to say she was perfect but still not exactly perfect, because the know she was human and still sharing the human nature needed salvation.

I've heard things like "without *actual* sin" but this makes it sound like we're engaging a legal understanding of sin (like saying, yeah she was mortal like the rest of us but never broke the speed limit on her donkey). I'm not interested in anything other than praise for the Mother of our Lord, I'm not trying to speak any evil of someone so honored by God. I should, as it were, shut my mouth and sing a bunch of silly songs in my head to even clear out my mind of any such thing.

But sinless, only if you get extremely precise in how you use that term.

I suppose my problem is that there are two different kinds of truth here and one is more important than the other. I just don't like to see the lesser of the two get mugged in the parking lot.

[Olga]

This is a rare personal opinion on matters scriptural, but the events of the wedding at Cana seem to me to illustrate both the humanity and the divinity of Christ in equal measure: Yes, He did seem to dismiss His mother's suggestion, but later, when He saw the time was right, He nevertheless did as His mother had suggested, and performed His first miracle. Listen to your mama!

This also has relevance to the Orthodox view of the Mother of God being the Queen and Mother; she does not rule in her own right, but has particular favour with the King as special intecessor for the people.

[Matthew Panchisin]

Dear Ryan,

Christ is Risen!

If we keep in mind that the lamb of God, Christ, is the one who takes away the sin of the world we can see that at the time the Theotokas had a vainglorious thought (according to what you are reconveying) the fulfillment of all things in Christ had been unfolding.

I think we could say she listened to Christ, after all she exhorts others to listen to Christ or rather specifically "do whatever he says" in other places, so this is a matter of obedience. She calls others to obedience to Christ out of love knowing well the fruit of obedience. Human beings can be tempted, it is the response that is most important. We can bring to mind that Christ truly God and truly man was tempted by the devil, that is from the outside since the devil has no place in him. Do keep in mind that the divide brought about by sin in the relationship between God (the creator) and his creatures (the created) was bridged by the Theotokas, God's created woman, the great gift in the fulfillment of time for mankind. I find a comment by William Wordsworth fitting to mention, 'our tainted nature's solitary boast'. The boast for us is because of her responses to God, the boast or rather her rejoicing and ours is in the resurrection of her child, Christ our God. So her joy and ours is bound together in Christ because of God, her, and all those that do his will, love and suffer. All of creation rejoiceth because of her obedient response, her suffering turns into great joy.

"whosoever shall do the will of My Father Who is in heaven, the same is My brother, and sister, and mother."

It is axiomatic that the Theotokas didn't own vainglory, she is not subject to the devil and his machinations, she crushes the head of the serpent, iconically through love, with God and in obedience to him. How often have we sung and heard in Church during these days, Christ is risen fro the dead conquering death by death and to those in the tombs bestowing life. So by death to ourselves, worldly ways and in obedience to Christ and his Church we can see that Christ reigns. But this is brought about with suffering. I mention this because a vainglorious thought for the exceedingly humble Mother of God might be seen more as oppressive (it didn't work, one really could say it couldn't work) rather than equating the notion of her having a "vainglorious thought" as sin per say.

We might choose to recall that if it was a sin to be tempted or have a thought from the devil then the old Eve and hence all of creation would have fallen before she ate of the forbidden fruit. The new Eve eats not of the forbidden fruit, in her icon she points to the way and the truth, Christ, the only begotton son of God.

I think that perhaps the reason that Blessed Theophylact or others mention the vainglorious thought might not be so that we reconcile the understanding that the Theotokos is sinless, but rather that we might embrace obedience to correction as so many others that have been honored by God in the past have done.

In Christ,

Matthew Panchisin

[Alice]

This is a rare personal opinion on matters scriptural, but the events of the wedding at Cana seem to me to illustrate both the humanity and the divinity of Christ in equal measure: Yes, He did seem to dismiss His mother's suggestion, but later, when He saw the time was right, He nevertheless did as His mother had suggested, and performed His first miracle. Listen to your mama!

This also has relevance to the Orthodox view of the Mother of God being the Queen and Mother; she does not rule in her own right, but has particular favour with the King as special intecessor for the people.

Amen, amen, amen!!! Beautifully said, and so poignant!

Most Holy Theotokos, save us!!!

[Vasiliki D.]

Archimandrite Sophrony echoes the thoughts of St Silouan beatifully on this matter, p391:



"...once when I was a young novice I was praying before an ikon of the Mother of God, and the Jesus Prayer entered into my heart and there began to repeat itself of its own accord. Ans another time in church I was listening to a reading from the Prophet Isaiah, and at the words, 'wash you, make you clean (Isaiah i:16). I reflected, 'Maybe the Mother of God sinned at one time or another, if only in thought.' And, marvellously to relate, in unison with my prayer a voice surrounded in my heart, saying clearly, 'The Mother of God never sinned even in thought.'

Thus did the Holy Spirit bear witness in my heart to her purity. But during her earthly life even she was not quite perfect and complete - she did make some mistakes that did not involve sin. We can see this from the Gospel when on the return from jerusalem she did not know where her Son was, and together with Jospeh sought Him for three days (cf. Luke ii:44-46) ... "