Dry prayer or no prayer

[A. Robinson]

The Fathers often stress the need for praying with fervor and feeling when we are saying our prayers, and how if you are merely saying your prayers without that feeling, then you "honoring God with your lips while your heart is far from Him" and this cannot really be considered prayer at all. However, I don't see how you can just make yourself feel certain things. I don't see how you can just pull fervor out of thin air. So I'm wondering, what do we do if we are in this state. If the last thing you want to do is pray and you are just not into it at all, and especially if this becomes a fairly consistent thing, what do you do?

[Paul Cowan]

If the last thing you want to do is pray and you are just not into it at all, and especially if this becomes a fairly consistent thing, what do you do?

You pray anyway.

Sometimes God "cools" your heart so you don't become complacent. Once the heart "feels" the loss of that special something it yearns for it back more than before. And God will honor the attempt.

Paul

[Peter S.]

Hi A. Robinson. Christ is risen!

I have also problems with what you are saying. Maybe you can read the Bible. Then pray just after that. Or maybe you can watch a biblical film, then pray. Watch/meditate on icons, then pray. (for inspiration). You can't watch "Jesus of Nazareth" every evening of course. There are even more things to do to inspire. A look at monachos.net maybe. Some church-music??...,I don't know...

Pray the jesusprayer instead of the ordinary evening prayers. variate prayer. Or just pray some few prayers (f.ex The beginning and endingprayers).

Or just decide: "I must pray all these morning/eveningprayers no matter what". With pauses if it is nescessary. Ask your spiritual father about that.

(Some jesusprayers can be good enough for me, but I feel I have do do 50 or 100.) I wonder if I ever have prayed for real btw, maybe some few times. But as Paul says God accept the effort.

the tricky one is to decide to go up from the sofa and stand before the icons. then it is easier to start to pray when that is done. Think about that when you sit in the sofa and don't want to pray... It's like when you have started training; it's ok when you are in action, but maybe not before. Isn't it like that with you when it comes to prayer?

Sometimes I even just say "Our father" and "Hail Mary", and then go to bed, but then I must pray for real those prayers, the best I can. You are not alone in not wanting to pray...

These Pascal days I read the pascal canon as prayers btw. Not just for variation. And in other festal periods I can read just the festal liturgical texts as prayers I must confess. Or maybe think: "The Devil don't want me to pray" Then you get up from the sofa like a rocket. ;)

Peter

[Mary]

I think, like seasons, there are dry times and productive times in our feelings too. To some extent, it is wise to ignore feelings, whether good or bad. I find it very hard to pray when I go through the dry times. I used to feel so guilty for dry prayers, that I'd stop them altogether. But that wasn't smart. Because that would leave me open to sin and despair. So, I decided, I'd just be honest. Before I begin my prayers, I ask God to forgive me for my lack of interest in praying. And then, I ask him to accept my act of praying, for whatever it is worth. And then, I read through the prayers. Sometimes, that helps to break out of the dry spell. Other times, it doesn't.

Recently, I didn't want to pray, because I was feeling so guilty. Then, I remembered some prayers that my friend had sent me a long time ago, to pray when I had failed to resist my temptations. I thought I'd try it out, and as I went through those prayers, I wondered if those saints had written those prayers specifically for me, because, word for word, they were the thoughts in my own heart! Included in those set of prayers, was Ps 142/43 - it was able to capture all my ambiguous feelings and thoughts in words!

Then, there are times, that I begin to pray, and I can't finish because there's too much going on in my heart and head, so I ask God to forgive me for not being able to finish my prayers and I just talk to Him about the things that are bothering me so much.

These are just the things that I do... I haven't been directed by anyone to do this or that. So, I don't direct anyone else to do this or that either.

In Christ,
Mary.

[Effie Ganatsios]

I'm sorry that I don't remember who told us to just keep on praying, even when we feel that we are surrounded by emptiness. I have the feeling that St. Ephrem said this but I am not sure. If I find the exact quotation I will post it.

We all go through dry spells, even periods of doubt and the illusion that we are deluding ourselves and that we want to believe that there is a higher power and that is why we do. As I said these are just illusions. Trust in God and the dry spells in prayer will end. If you stop praying how then will God connect with you? I noticed that there is another new thread about the Akathist of Thanksgiving. I haven't read this thread yet but I can tell you that when I have my own periods of emptiness, reading this Akathist reaches right into my heart and warms it. And I wait on God.

Effie

[Andreas Moran]

Years ago, I asked Archimandrite Zacharias about these periods of dryness. Elder Sophrony writes about them also. He (Fr Z.) said we must treasure these periods - they are very valuable because God is gently testing us in much the way that previous posts have indicated.

[Mary]

I wonder, sometimes, if my 'dry prayers' aren't more real than the ones that I feel were from my heart? Isn't it a delusion, to think I've prayed a good prayer? It's hard to not think that, when my heart is full of good feelings, and I've enjoyed every moment and every word of the prayers. But, when I offer up a dry prayer - that's when I'm aware of my own emptiness; that without God, I have nothing worthwhile to give; that it is only because of His mercifulness and love for mankind that my prayers are heard; that there is nothing I can do, to make myself more worthy of being in His presence or belonging to Him...

I don't know. Just a few random thoughts.

In Christ,
Mary.

[Andreas Moran]

It's for God to evaluate our prayer, not us.

[Paul Cowan]

Just as the presence of spiritual warmth in the heart is sweet, so is its absence bitter, wearisome and frightening. It has been said already that it goes when attention and heart deviate from things of the spirit and turn towards things not of the spirit. By this is not meant something sinful - since a man who has had a taste of spiritual warmth is no longer attracted to sin - but all the soul-body realm, vain, earthly, created. As soon as attention incline towards it, spiritual warmth immediately declines; but when the heart also cleaves to it, it withdraws altogether, leaving behind coldness towards all things divine and towards God Himself, accompanied by indifference to all spiritual works and occupations, practised for the purpose of preserving this warmth. If a man recollects himself at once and hastens to re-establish his habitual warmth-producing order, this warmth returns quickly or not so quickly. But if he pays no attention to it, and through being dispersed, infatuated with something or self-reliant, deliberatly allows himself to linger in this cooling atmosphere, and especially if he takes the risk of satisfying in actual deed his non-spiritual tastes resurrected by it, his very zeal for spiritual life becomes undermined, if not completely deadened. The latter is the forerunner of falling into former habitual sins, which will not fail to overcome the negligent. But if a man recollects himself, he has no difficulty in returning to his spiritual state, even from there.

This is how cooling always happens; it is always through our own fault, since it is produced by weakening of attention and of watchfulness over oneself. This weakening is caused either by the temptations of a man's worldly surroundings, and when forms of worldly prelest stupefy a man and abduct him from his own self; or by the wiles of the enemy, who contrives to induce a man to come out of his inner self, which the enemy sometimes succeeds in doing, merely by adding his own more attractive picture to the natural flow of images of fantasy, and sometimes by somehow affecting also the body. But, whatever the cause, the action of cooling begins with the attention coming out of the inner depths, and its further progress is established by the heart cleaving to something, at first vain and empty, and later passionate and sinful. And in every case it is a man's own fault. For neither the world nor the devil can violate man's freedom; they can only subject it to temptation.

Sometimes cooling is due to the action of grace. In its true aspect, spiritual warmth is the fruit of grace present in the heart. When grace comes, the heart is warm, when it goes - it is cold. Grace also leaves a man, when he comes out of himself attracted by wrong things. Then this cooling is and is called punitive. But sometimes grace withdraws of its own accord, for the purpose of assisting the spiritual progress of the servants of God. And in such cases this withdrawl is and is called instructive. But in this instance the consequences are still the same - cooling, a sensation of emptiness in the heart; for the guest and visitor has gone. The difference between these coolings is that the guilty cooling weakens the very zeal of spiritual life, whereas cooling due to an instructive withdrawl of grace makes it burn with even grrater fervour, which is also one of the purposes of such withdrawl.

Divine grace withdraws of its own accord for purposes of instruction for the following reasons; to excite zeal, which sometimes slackens through a long period of calm; to make a man examine his situation with greater attention and reject the attachments and occupations not directly connected with a life acceptable to God and not leading to Him; - to increase and strengthen the consciousness and feeling that everything good in us is the fruit of God's grace; - to make us value more highly the gifts of God in the future, care more about preserving them, and be more deeply humble; - to make us surrender with greater sencerity into the hands of Divine providence, with complete self-denial and self-belittlement; to force us not to become attached to spiritual delights themsleves, thus dividing our heart in two, since God wishes the whole of it to belong to Him alone; to prevent us from relaxing our efforts when Divine grace works in us, but to make us toil without sleeping on the path of God, straining all the powers with which he has endowed us precisely for this purpose.

Thus, even when cooling results from an instructive withdrawl of Divine grace, you yourself are the cause of it, since, although Divine grace withdraws of its own accord, it does so with its eye on you. So when you feel a cooling for spiritual things and occupations and generally for all divine things, enter deeply into yourself and examine carefully why it has happened; and, if it is your fault, hasten to eliminate and efface it, not so much because you are anxious for the return of spiritual delights, but rather because you want to destroy in yourself all that is unfitting and not pleasing to God. If you find nothing of this kind, submit to God's will, saying to yourself: 'God has decided: let Thy will be done on me, O Lord, weak and unworthy as I am.' Then be patient and wait, never allowing yourself to deviate from the habitual order of your spiritual life and spiritual works and exercises. Overcome the lack of taste for them, which has assailed you, by forcibly making yourself practise them, paying no attention to thougts which try to distract you from your efforts by suggesting that this occupation is useless; drink willingly your cup of bitterness, saying to the Lord: 'See my humility and my efforts, O Lord, and deprive me not of they mercy,' and let your efforts be inspired by the faith that this cup comes from God's love for you, because He desires you to attain a greater spiritual perfection.



And much more is written on this before and after, but this was the meat of the chapter.

forgive me,
Paul

[Nina]

A. if you are in this state of being sad that you can't pray maybe you can use this sadness to sigh the "Lord have mercy!" The Jesus prayer also can be repeated when you do other things during your daily routine.

[Peter S.]

A. if you are in this state of being sad that you can't pray maybe you can use this sadness to sigh the "Lord have mercy!" The Jesus prayer also can be repeated when you do other things during your daily routine.

Yes, these is also a good advices. To sigh "Jesus" is also a prayer, at least it can be.

Peter

[Nina]

To sigh "Jesus" is also a prayer,
Peter

Exactly. Elder Cleopas I think says that sighs of the name of Christ are prayers and when we mention the name of our Lord Jesus/Christ it has so much power that we can not imagine. It has also the purification power and the turning our mind to God. I have had many days in my life when I have been just saying only "My Christ! My Panaghia" and repetition of Jesus prayer because I couldn't pray.

[Peter S.]

Exactly. Elder Cleopas I think says that sighs of the name of Christ are prayers

Such sighs can come when you are not aware of it. From within. At least the first time. Then it is the Holy Spirit that works I suppose. People can even pray the jesusprayer and say "Jesus" when asleep. I think St. martyr Ignatios did that. And they found "Jesus" ie. "Iesous" in golden letters inside his heart according to the legend. That was definetly not dry prayer... And not very emotional prayer either, I believe(?). But maybe he too had his dry periods in the beginning.

Peter

[Ilaria]

In my case, it worked out by "switching" the direction of prayer; I mean, you have one-two-three... relatives or friends who are facing problems and you begin to think about their hardships and then prayer comes; at least with one feeling - of compassion, but compassion does not come alone...
remember st Silouan's power of prayer for the others; we cannot compare with him, he prayed for the whole world
but let us pray for our little world, for our dearest ones and I am convinced that our heart will be comforted by God;
and when we got this little comfort let us switch more...let it turn to the enemies

[Nina]

Try to attain to the full measure of this Name, and you will find it on your mouth and on the mouths of your children. When you make high festival and when you rejoice, cry "Jesus." When anxious and in pain, cry "Jesus." When little boys and little girls are laughing, let them cry, "Jesus." And those who flee before barbarians, cry, "Jesus." And those who go down to the river, cry "Jesus." And those who see wild beasts and sights of terror, cry "Jesus." Those who are taken off to prison, cry "Jesus." And those whose trial has been corrupted and who receive injustice, cry the Name of Jesus.

Shenoute of Atripe, Contra Origenistas 821
5th century

[Alice]

Exactly. Elder Cleopas I think says that sighs of the name of Christ are prayers and when we mention the name of our Lord Jesus/Christ it has so much power that we can not imagine. It has also the purification power and the turning our mind to God. I have had many days in my life when I have been just saying only "My Christ! My Panaghia" and repetition of Jesus prayer because I couldn't pray.

Yes, this is a very good post and point you make dear Nina...

So simple but when said in earnest sigh, so profound. We use their most holy names as prayer, but just listen to any movie and it is so different...

It upsets me so much that people use the name of our Lord with anger, with disrespect, and/or for a sarcastic response...

Ofcourse Greece is not immune to this disrespect either.

Kyrie Eleison!!

[Peter S.]

Then, there are times, that I begin to pray, and I can't finish because there's too much going on in my heart and head, so I ask God to forgive me for not being able to finish my prayers and I just talk to Him about the things that are bothering me so much.

In Christ,
Mary.

I think I am not the only one who recognizes these to my prayers. Then it happens I think of Jesus who said that when you pray you shall not pray lenghty prayers and vain repetitions as the hypocrites, and then thaught the Lords prayer. It can be enough. But when I do it's a bit ironic... It seems like a good idea to talk to God about what bothers you when this happens too. Prayer can be many things as said in this thread. Jesus or the saints is the focus.

Peter

[Nicolaj]

If the last thing you want to do is pray and you are just not into it at all, and especially if this becomes a fairly consistent thing, what do you do?

Yes, this is one of the most difficult trials we have to make while living. The Fathers in the Desert were already familiar with this phenomenon, I think they called it the dark Night of Faith. Praying becomes so senseless to us.
But there is much we can also say about our prayers in times of drying wells.
The most useful is to pray as much as we can, and if it is just calling his most blessed Name, which is for the demons like a whip which haunts them away.
Please try to call his blessed Name as much as you are up to, and time will work-out for you.

Christos Voskrese! Nicolaj